There are better ways to “stop the boats” than by destroying people’s lives
Labor finally found enough courage to actually remember we are dealing with people when we talk about the folk living in Hotel California (you can check out any time you want but you can never leave) accommodation on Manus and Nauru.
But let’s not forget that it was actually the courage of the crossbench that got them there.
No doubt Labor is savouring a legislative defeat of the government but I sincerely hope they don’t try to use this to play political games about no confidence in the government. The election will come soon enough and, quite frankly, the government is not improving its image with the passage of time.
We have already been shown that the Coalition intend to make this a big issue but will it resonate with people who are suffering drought, floods and fire? Will offering health treatment to the refugees who we have incarcerated for over five years be resented?
If bringing people here for medical treatment in the past didn’t open the floodgates, then why would it now? Not to mention the millions we would save in the countless unsuccessful court cases the government has prosecuted trying to overrule medical advice and the millions they have already been forced to pay out in compensation.
I have heard Peter Dutton quote specific people smugglers as saying their village was ramping up in anticipation of a change of government. Well could I suggest that he pass that information on to the authorities in Indonesia and Australia so they can keep such people under surveillance and arrest them if they start soliciting or taking payments.
We have boats and aircraft and drones and all manner of personnel deployed to turn back any boats that may attempt to come here.
Why not pay for an advertising campaign in transit countries, not designed to terrify people, but to inform them of the legal ways they can get here?
Why not establish and fund processing centres in transit countries with timely feedback to applicants on the progress of their applications?
Why not increase the humanitarian intake and fly people here?
Why not consult with regions who may be willing to sponsor refugee families in order to revitalise regional areas and encourage decentralisation?
Why not take up the New Zealand offer? (Peter Dutton said on 7:30 report they haven’t ruled it out. Funny, I remember different)
Why not increase foreign aid and development programs, human rights activism, action on climate change and peace initiatives so people didn’t have to flee their homes in the first place?
There are so many positive things we could do to do our share of helping but, instead, we are going to have months of a dishonest dog-whistling scare campaign from a government who has no imagination, no compassion, no ideas and no authority.
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Diane -
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Diannaart
Return to home pageThe answer to all of the above is that the LNP have never wanted a solution to the problem, they have only ever wanted a ready weapon at hand to use in scare campaigns against Labor. The people themselves have always been irrelevant…such a tragedy.
Carol,
Labor have disappointed me in the past by tolerating such inhumanity though, to be fair, they have not really been in a position to do anything about it for the last six years.
At the moment, I feel like I did when my teenage son cooked his first meal for the family. I want to be encouraging and am holding back from suggesting that next time the pizza could have some other toppings beside tomato paste and cheese. (I am resisting shouting Bring Them Here for fear of spooking the horses)
In so many areas, this government focuses on punishment for doing the “wrong” thing rather than encouragement and support to do the right thing. They should have some professional development classes in positive reinforcement. Oh wait…..they do. What could you call the Wilson roadshow other than positive reinforcement of wealth, privilege and entitlement.
Reply to Carol Taylor: Exactly right. They actually want the boats to come again. They’ll cry crocodile tears if people drown, but it will be good copy for the fascist press here in Australia. I remember that ever so compassionate Joe Hockey in opposition, saying with stammering voice that he would allow children to to go to Malaysia ‘over his dead body’. The Malaysian solution looked like it might work, but the Liberals could not allow that to happen. It was only later in the piece when they discovered ‘drownings at sea’ could be used for political purposes and then the compassion tap was turned on again.
Kaye Lee thinks we should wait till May, but I disagree. All those things she is rightly concerned about will not be addressed by this government while they spend their time worrying about themselves. Let’s get rid of them as soon as possible. Remember also that the GG was a military man and will still have some influence with the defence force. Trump has hinted that he may not bother having another election. I feel that Trump has enabled the likes of Morrison to break with conventions that have kept this country on a reasonably even keel and I would not put it past him to invoke martial law on the pretext of some false flag emergency.
A pox on their houses.
Oh I agree….the sooner they are gone the better. I just don’t want political games played over this issue.
Martial law won’t happen here. It isn’t good for the alcohol and gambling lobby. Imagine telling the guys at the pub we are bringing back 6 o’clock closing and Sunday closing. They’d destroy the joint.
I’m really beginning to think that Scummo’s barely suppressed paranoia, and more than just a tinge of madness, is starting to come through as he finds more pressure and stress heaped upon him.
https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/leaders/politics-live-tuesday-february-12/news-story/bf2f21a1e55821c06ff73798eefe1686
Why not outline a set of principles that provide an anchor point for policy developments? Ones that could be universalised across the social, economic, political et al spectrum …
But perhaps the wrong voters would turn up? Also – fairly certain the wrong politicians would arrive. You know, the ones that specialise in deals – which lack even a passing relationship with same. But isn’t that a requirement for the job?
Perhaps the real enemy is the (generalised) us? And we simply don’t want to recognise or admit it? Preferring instead to howl at the moon or invent scapegoats …
Salaryman Scotty will bravely ignore all these fancypants. He could declare a National Emergency about ‘Boats’ and push the election date back further to June.
Perhaps a better way would be to hire a QANTAS jumbo to fly from Indonesia to Australia carrying legal refugees which would remove any chance of “Children Overboard” or drownings at sea. This would just be an extension of the present government policy encouraging and accept migrants from the PRC so that the NSW NLP misgovernment can benefit from residential real estate sales in Sydney.
‘Why not establish and fund processing centres in transit countries with timely feedback to applicants on the progress of their applications?’…I think this and some other of your suggestions are part of Labor’s policy, including $450m to support UNHCR in the region.
How…how dare Tony Smith put propriety ahead of party! He’s one of us, the Born to Rule party!
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/speaker-tony-smith-puts-propriety-before-politics-and-lets-the-government-suffer-20190212-p50xdd.html
Methinks the daggers are being sharpened after what he did regarding the Medivac bill.
And now that bloody git Hinch could scupper the whole deal –
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/derryn-hinch-throws-future-of-refugee-medical-transfer-bill-into-doubt-20190213-p50xej.html
The man is a, pardon the French, f*ckwit of the highest order. You can bet Scummo won’t miss a chance to try and “help” him change his mind
The standard Coalition Fear and Loathing strategy will be ramping up severely now using both the boats and “pensioner tax” barrels and probably nothing else.
No word in the media about the 64,000 refugee applicants who flew in during their watch but that’s not as dramatic as potential drownings (some of which also happened due to turn-backs in severe conditions). Likewise, not much comparative noise about the 12 or so who died during our off-shore care.
Of course Morrison wouldn’t be in this position if Dutton hadn’t tried to replace Turnbull, thereby allowing Phelps into the Parliament to introduce that Bill to their now reduced slim majority. Now if they let a few boats slip by and try to blame Labor all that will do is expose their own turn-back policy as being a failure. (Despite their claims, boats have still been coming).
Karma can be a bitch.
As for a solution, all they need to do is establish formal UNHCR processing in Indonesia.
Eventually someone will realise that refugees are not the problem but a symptom of another problem and putting band-aids on a gaping wound is seldom successful. Until then, at least one side of politics will continue to benefit from the misery of others.
Kronomex – he’s looking for a renewal
of his speakership. It’s a sure sign he thinks the Coalition is a dead duck.
Whilst pedantry is annoying, there is something that is dreadfully tiresome in the screeching and hollering over the Duddo/Scummo sideshow, reminiscent of the ‘carbon tax’ debacle.
Remember that? There was no carbon tax. Yet it was a totally acceptable mantra, largely repeated, unquestioned, for years, to give credence to an ideology and remove scrutiny.
“There are better ways to “stop the boats” than by destroying people’s lives”
Whilst in absolute agreement with the sentiment and the suggestions contained in your article, it repeats the lie. The boats never stopped. The government most often turned them around, on occasion paying people smugglers to ‘go back where they came from’. The government stopped reporting the attempts and MSM swung into compliance mode, permitting a veil of secrecy. Even with their ‘ring of steel’, the boats arrived.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-27/daintree-suspected-illegal-fishing-boat-two-arrested/10167836
In his little temper tanty yesterday, Scummo stated the next boat arrival will be on Shorten. I was unaware that border security had been ceded to the ALP. Has Duddo relinquished his portfolio to Shayne Neumann? Have they told the navy and border force to return to port? On what planet do these cretins live? Naturally, the compliant media don’t ask such questions.
As for setting up regional processing centres, it is a matter of logic. There is one thing we can rest assured of. This government, regardless of which hapless fool is ‘in charge’, will never be accused of applying logic, let alone reason (and, heaven forbid, compassion).
This is yet another failed marketing campaign from the worst marketing ‘guru’ ever to walk the planet. Its only prospect of survival is if we keep repeating the lie, giving oxygen to a spurious deceit.
My apologies in advance for the intemperate tone. This vote, whilst laudable, does not even begin to address the barbarity of this regime, let alone offer redress for the damage it has caused. We had sedated the incarcerated, in the absence of medical treatment.
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/exclusive-nauru-s-prescription-drug-records-reveal-mental-health-crisis
Now we offer them a very temporary respite. Is it any wonder that those suffering our persecution don’t see it as anything more than a deferral of the inevitable.
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/feb/13/i-cant-see-any-gleam-of-hope-refugees-in-nauru-on-medevac-bill
Thank you Ms Lee and commenters. Take care
This issue is not secure yet – the Dutton-Puzzello mob are working overtime on Derron Hinch.
Full credit to the Speaker yesterday for handling the Parliament well in difficult circumstances. Can you imagine how Bronny Bishop would have handled it?
Given the desperate actions of Pyne, Dutton and Shouty McShoutface over the past day, I would not be at all surprised if Border Farce and Operation Sovereign Borders are required to “engineer” the arrival of a boat or two. Remember this mob have great form in such evil deceptions – Peter Reith and “children overboard” was very instrumental in the Lying Rodent winning an election and this mob are even more desperate.
It may assist this discussion to consider the comments of the Brisbane Coroner in July 2018 following the death of twenty-four year old Hamid Khazaei after delays and bungling of his medical evacuation from Manus to Australia.
See here : https: //www.courts.qld.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0005/577607/cif-khazaei-h-20180730.pdf
The significant point made by the Coroner and the impetus for this legislative change was that :
This, believe it or not, is what we are talking about
The greatest threat to Australia’s security in the broadest sense is not refugees, but the Liberal Party.
@Frank Smith ….”….Border Farce and Operation Sovereign Borders are required to “engineer” the arrival of a boat or two”. Such an arrival will NOT be presented as a failure of their operations. No , it will be represented as entirely the result of this legislation.
Why wait until a boat arrives to waste money….
“Prime Minister Scott Morrison may have lost a historic vote in Parliament, but acted swiftly this morning. He’s announced, after meeting with his national security committee, that Australia will reopen its detention facilities on Christmas Island. The argument is that the medical evacuation bill that is set to pass the Senate soon, will undermine border protection policies and could restart the people smuggling trade. It’s a real ramping up of national security as we head into an election.”
Peter F, one wonders about the capabilities of our defence force. If we are at threat from some refugee boats then perhaps the Chinese and Russians can save themselves a lot of money and use (leaky) fishing boats to invade other countries. Will these boats be carrying modern missile systems and CIW systems (rapid firing cannon radar controlled), main battle tanks, jet fighter interceptors, drones, advanced search radar systems (over the horizon), satellite guidance systems???? I would have thought that a single patrol boat guided by good surveillance would be able to deal with a boat or boats. I sit here trembling at the thought of one of these boats making landfall somewhere on the north-western coast. What a bloody joke. Surely the ADF chiefs must be fuming at the insults coming their way. What a bloody joke.
From what Morrison is suggesting it would appear that we have the most pathetically inadequate defence force in the world.
Even if some boats do suddenly and mysteriously manage to avoid the ring of steel and make it to Australia, it will not help the Government’s cause. The public cynicism around the issue is now so widespread, largely due to the hysterical claims of Pyne, Dutton and Morrison, that it won’t make an iota of difference, they are toast. One wonders what Julie Bishop, as a vaguely sensible person, is thinking watching from her lofty position on the backbench as the bunch of idiots dig their own graves ever deeper. Once they are defeated, and she has kept Porter out of her seat, she will surely move to greener pastures rather than enduring the wilderness of what promises ( hopefully) to be a long time in opposition.
Many correspondents are now suggesting that orders will go out to the navy to allow a boat/boats through to just show how dangerous to Australia Bill Shorten is. But there is a danger for the government in this. In these days of leaking, who can say that a sailor or sailors might not leak that fact. It would be a disaster for Morrison.
Still on that point, if this Medivac bill is so important for national security, then it must be overturned as soon as possible. Therefore there need to be an immediate election with a win to the coalition to protect Australia.
Sorry for making so many posts, but I’m retired and have time to read the blogs and grind my teeth.
A short time ago the BBC reported Scomo has ordered the reopening of the Christmas Island centre in preparation for the ‘Labor assisted’ boat arrivals.
He also went on record as saying there will now be pedophiles and rapists roaming the streets of Australia, seeking out prey after being transported from Manus Island. True scare mongering Trumpism. What a sick, sorry lot this rabble of a non Govt is.
Extreme desperation!! Penny Wong has the solution – call an election immediately. One wonders what Peter Cosgrove may be thinking right now – Scummo is painting Cosgrove’s beloved Defence Force as being completely incapable of defending Australia from a few unarmed people in a fishing boat as OC has noted – might be time to act in your GG capacity Sir Peter.
Old Codger,
The thing I love about this site is the conversation that follows articles. No need to apologise for being part of it. I welcome your thoughts. And Lord knows, things are happening so fast we have to help each other keep up.
Kaye Lee….thank you.
My opinion is that stopping boats effectively, through patrolling, is the real deterrent to people smuggling; the offshore “processing” and blanket removal of rights to seek asylum in Australia if arriving by boat is purely racist dog-whistling for local consumption. I also think the “saving lives from drowning” line is kept distinctly separate from the issue of high death rates for refugees in the places they are attempting to leave – to keep the illusion that there is compassion at the core of the choice to force back refugees; I can’t see any.
It may be humanity’s most problematic trait that we can get satisfaction and even enjoyment from the suffering of others, so long as we think they are Bad. Note all the rhetoric aimed at convincing us these refugees are Bad. No weighing of evidence is required to decide people are bad – just someone we trust or like saying so can be enough. Or just being of the same nationality, religion, race, political allegiance as someone who is bad can be enough. For our political leaders to deliberately engage in this kind of rhetoric is dangerously unethical – and for mainstream media to be such willing and active proponents is frightening. To turn about and claim there is no racism is involved or intended is the worst kind of lying – the lying that starts with themselves.
When I was a student teacher, I was lucky enough on one prac to be with an amazing teacher who truly had the respect of her students and who was helping each one of them to improve both as mathematicians and as people. I remember her talking to one student who had misbehaved. She didn’t yell. She didn’t rant and rave. She quietly, and with genuine emotion, took him aside and told him how disappointed she was. The kid was devastated rather than the defiance we often force people into by coming at them with aggression or when we publicly humiliate them. I learned a lot from her.
The point of that ramble is that you don’t have to be cruel to be strong and effective – something Morrison and Dutton don’t seem to understand.
While the safe arrival of boats might give some amunition for the LNP; not allowing sick refugees to gain proper attention and dying as a result means the LNP have blood on their hands. Through Court action, by passing cruel decision making, some refugees have attained medical attention in Australia. Have the number of boats increased .. no. At least one person per week is killed through domestic violence .. the LNP do bugger all about that.
To have the capacity to believe the LNP you need to switch your mind to neutral.
A very recent Report from the Pentagon in the US indicates that climate change poses real security problems for military installations and personel. When conservative Agencies such as the Pentagon write Reports about security problems caused through climate change you need to take notice.
Explanation:
https://www.vox.com/2019/1/18/18188153/pentagon-climate-change-military-trump-inhofe
Report:
https://climateandsecurity.files.wordpress.com/2019/01/sec_335_ndaa-report_effects_of_a_changing_climate_to_dod.pdf
Another way of saying the LNP do not do security well.
Keith,
I have a relative who is a diplomat in a Middle Eastern country. Morrison’s thought bubble to move the embassy to Jerusalem posed a real threat to the safety of embassy staff because they had not been warned about it, not to mention military stationed overseas and even Australian business people. As he said to me, “I have spent so much time building up relationships and trust, with it all blown away with one announcement”.
Morrison is an amateur.
Ken Fabian,
Great comment.
Point 1. The boats have never stopped coming.
Point 2. We now know that Morrison has ‘quietly’ (his words), let hundreds of refugees into Australia for medical treatment under the current legislation.
Point 3. Under the new law any-one arriving by boat will not be eligible to participate in the scheme as in point 2. and will be stuck in the same situation as the other poor souls found themselves in.
Point 3. Question for Morrison. Which of the two choices does he think the people smugglers will sell to the refugees seeking to come to Australia ?
Scummo is losing it big time at the moment and coming across as almost deranged (Bacillus Trumpii maybe?). This is not the reaction of a normal person, this is the reaction of someone with sanity issues.
A “Government” in crisis. They lost 5 or 6 votes in quick succession in the House yesterday and another 3 or 4 in the Senate this morning (too many for me to keep count of). Surely, rather than running around in a mad frenzy attempting to blame everyone else but themselves for the chaos in Parliament, it is time that Scummo accepted the fact that his Government LOST all these votes, he is not governing and he needs to go to Yarralumla and advise the Governor that an election needs to be called immediately. No clearer message can be delivered to a Government than occurred yesterday and this morning.
Ken, good points.
We can’t underestimate the media’s role in spreading this fake narrative. We saw this in Britain with the Brexit vote: the Murdoch media played the racism card and it swung the vote.
herr dutton is already calling his mates in Indo trying to arrange an armada…
meanwhile when quizzed by Leigh Sales over how many detainees are actually murderers, rapists and paedophiles
he demurred and as usual blamed Labor and exclaimed that any boats that get through will be on Bill Shorten’s head
Mathias Cormann on Twitter March 20th 2013 –
“Julia Gillard no longer has majority in House of Representatives. Suspension vote on no confidence 73/71. She should resign. Election now!”
Perhaps a bit of wibble-wobble happening in the Government at the moment?
If you have a Facebook account, please take a minute to cast your vote on the Channel 7 poll just to redress (hopefully) the balance of those who believe everything they are told by the LNP and their tame media https://www.facebook.com/yahoo7/posts/2520112861339452
One of my neighbours – an otherwise intelligent man – saw on TV that Manus and Naru are like tropical paradises, where the refugees sip on cocktails from their sun loungers whilst planning their next riot, and was adamant that was the true story, despite me trying to point him at stuff to read to get the real facts and make his own decision.
I fear it’s people like him who will believe whatever lies Morrison and co spin… and having watched Fahrenheit 11/9 where everyone was convinced Trump couldn’t win…. I am scared the same will happen here!
@Diane I have shared
Breaking news: Government to build 104,789 new detention centres because of all the boats Labor will now let in.
I thought it was 104,790.
The LNP seems to be doing their version of the China Syndrome. It’s like watching a real world version of the infected people from the movie 28 Days Later and the only problem is that, unlike the film, we can’t have them put down as a major health disaster. Their rage is almost terrifying.
Diane, poll so far 72% to 28% in favour of Smirky’s gulag. Let the thieving raping murdering terrorists die horrible painful deaths while sucking on their gin slings, apparently.
@
pierre wilkinsonFebruary 13, 2019 at 3:29 pm
…herr dutton is already calling his mates in Indo trying to arrange an armada…
pierre I wouldn’t doubt that for one moment and probably making plenty on the side…he is corruption and evil personified. What the hell is wrong with the voters in Dickson, do they exist in another Universe by returning him as their rep in Parliament? It is sick!!!!
The people of Christmas Island are not cheering at Scummo’s plan to re-open the detention centre. They only have a small regional hospital that does not even do operations – patients have to be medivaced to Perth for that. And the island residents are only just starting to revive from the negative publicity brought onto them for 20 years by having the detention centre thrust upon them. Oh, Scummo, intelligent people think through consequences and consult before opening their motor-mouth.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-02-13/christmas-island-centre-reopening-branded-a-knee-jerk-reaction/10807368
@Paul Davis – I know, and rising… what the hell is wrong with people? A sad indictment on the results of a people saturated with one-sided Murdoch misinformation I fear…
Anybody notice Dutton’s remark on the 7:30 report about the new threat of alleged refugee paedophiles being brought into Australia because of the new legislation?
If that’s the case, why did he keep them locked up with children for 5 years?
Furthermore, now they are no longer being kept incarcerated do the Nauruan’s appreciate having them roam freely about their island at our behest?
It’s seeming more and more like the 2109 version of kids overboard.
I’m not sure how credible a news source True Crime Weekly is (but hey, New Idea is now the benchmark for investigative journalism so who knows?) but they are laying into FauxMo big time here https://truecrimenewsweekly.com/i-stopped-these-no-you-didnt-how-scott-morrisons-campaign-to-turn-back-the-boats-actually-destroyed-aussie-ships-almost-saw-sailors-die/?fbclid=IwAR05GsHAAmXqbPAV623F5nDnKPK1UeebITll1EDl-ls5WTYWEvmHeAruNew
Zathras, I agree there is a lot of logic which seems to be getting in the way of Morrison’s argument. Exactly. If all ‘these people’ are paedophiles, rapists and murderers then why aren’t they under lock and key on Nauru? Are our security staff (for whom we’ve been paying untold millions of dollars) just letting them roam around and mingle with the locals, including children?
And why is it that 1,000 people will be coming here? Is it that the entire asylum seeker/refugee populations of Manus and Nauru are so desperately ill or injured that they cannot be treated onsite? If so and then this explains Morrison’s panic, he doesn’t not want Australians to see how cruelly these people have treated and is desperate in his efforts to try to keep them hidden from view. My guess is that they will be whisked off to CI, unseen and anonymous which is the only way that Morrison and Dutton can maintain the rage in demonising them.
Zathras – As for a solution, all they need to do is establish formal UNHCR processing in Indonesia.
Exactly. I have never understood why the question has never been asked as to why the LNP cannot work with Indonesia to crack down on the people smuggler trade.
Very interesting link Diane. As regards the site’s credibility, they broke the news about Barnaby well before Shari Markson took an interest.
https://independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/giving-credit-where-credit-is-due,11776
I hope I’m not being completely obtuse here, but could someone help me out? Does the Medevac legislation apply only to Manus and Nauru? Is Morrison’s intention to move refugees to Christmas Island a ruse to avoid having to bring sick people to Australia?
Damn good point, Cara. We’d need to look at the wording in the legislation to confirm.
Cara Clark – while the legislation specifically applies (only) to those who are currently on Manus and Nauru, there is a real fear (confined to LNP supporters at this stage) that these cunning brown people have access to a time travel machine and will therefore be able to qualify retrospectively. As will their offspring for generations to come. You ought to see the line-up – it’s huge.
As for Christmas Island – it’s being reopened in anticipation of an unprecedent demand for such five star accommodation. Inside operators have already boosted the share price of QANTAS, other transport companies, catering organisations and the like as they also gear up to met the refugee onslaught.
AS for accommodating sick people, now that’s something they haven’t thought of yet.
Why not simply advertise in those countries that Australia will only be taking skilled people in the trades and professions that we currently need and let that be the end to it. I certainly don’t want a BIG Australia, as Rudd wants. Furthermore fluency in the English language should be a prerequisite to being accepted for settlement.
Christmas Island does not have more than basic medical facilities, anything else requires patients to be sent to mainland, just as is done, amid much deliberate bureaucratic delays, on Manus and Nauru.
Plus the cost of reopening Christmas Island detention camps …
https://www.sbs.com.au/news/christmas-island-not-equipped-to-deal-with-new-asylum-seekers-council