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Good debt, bad debt, and the stuff that is already paid for

Morrison’s “good debt, bad debt” spin has a twofold purpose.

Firstly, it is an admission that the Coalition has abandoned its foolhardy promise to eliminate debt and an attempt to justify them borrowing for pet projects.

Secondly, with his categorisation of recurring expenditure as “bad debt”, Morrison is softening us up for cuts to health, education and welfare.

But the figures show that we are not borrowing to fund these crucial aspects of our society.  We pay for them with our taxes and the revenue from our assets.

The last budget estimated that general government receipts would be $411.3 billion in 2016-17.  The total spending on education, health, social security and welfare was estimated to be $263.7 billion or 64% of receipts.

In 2019-20, total receipts were projected to be $500.7 billion with spending on education, health, social security and welfare to be $306.9 billion – 61% of receipts.

In other words, contrary to government rhetoric, recurrent expenditure on these items is projected to fall as a proportion of revenue.

Health and education are proven productivity enhancers, and the provision of a genuine safety net is a responsibility for a wealthy nation like ours.

Debt is certainly increasing with no sign of going backwards any time soon but it isn’t going towards health, education or welfare which are more than paid for by the citizens of Australia.

Let’s have a cost benefit analysis for 12 submarines and 72 dud jets and hundreds of billions being spent on war toys, war games and our interference in foreign conflicts.

Or a CBA for the offshore detainment of refugees.

Or a CBA for the Coalition’s Direct Action policy and ERF auctions.

Or a CBA for politicians’ expenses and the hundreds of millions given to parties by the electoral offices.

Or all the other non-productive things that we don’t want our money spent on that the government is borrowing to pay for.

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57 comments

  1. etnorb

    Another well written thought piece Kaye! Personally, I think that ALL debt is “bad debt”, but maybe that is just me. However, I am not overly familiar with matters financial, but I think I am capable of understanding ALL the bullshit that seems to emanate from ALL the Liberals. As far as I am concerned they all tell lies, untruths & distorted facts whenever they open their mouths!

  2. silkworm

    “… health, education or welfare which are more than paid for by the citizens of Australia.”

    Sorry, but this is just the recycled neoliberal meme that taxes pay for spending. You really need to get on board the MMT train.

  3. Freethinker

    Now Turnbull said the funds into the NBN represented a “good debt in the sense that it is secured to a financial asset”.
    I remember well what he and members of his team said before.

  4. Kaye Lee

    silkworm, are we destined to have this conversaqtion every article? I understand the possibilities suggested by MMT and do not disagree with them (though there are some questions MMTers will never answer like affects on exchange rate). But that is NOT the way this government works and will not be a feature of this budget which is what I am talking about.

    As it stands, the government will make up the difference between revenue and expenditure by issuing bonds. They don’t have to but they do. Please stop telling me I don’t understand.

  5. pierre wilkinson

    This mob has absolutely no idea how to run the country, the economy or a chook raffle in a pub.
    Thanks again for your insightful commentary.

  6. Harquebus

    Kaye Lee
    I take back my negative comment regarding your grasp of mathematics.
    Cheers.

  7. townsvilleblog

    Good debt is debt for infrastructure that will produce productivity which is precisely what the government should be spending money on, good debt is also health and education related because you need to build hospitals and schools to ensure a good standard of health and education to produce the people who can fill the jobs of the future and make sure they don’t die with a case of measles, then you could lose a valuable worker. Unfortunately LNP DNA does not see things this way, they consider any expense in t5he support of a healthy educated population a tremendous liability, which is why they cut $80 Billion out of public health and education in the 2014 budget and have never replaced that funding.
    They consider workers a dime a dozen and are happy to have 95,000 457 visa holders in Australia probably on reduced wages doing Australians out of work. The facts are that we have 1.1 million unemployed a rate of 9.4% of the total workforce, with a further 1.1 million people underemployed who are unable to get enough hours to support themselves or their family. This LNP government is at the height of incompetence and are mismanaging the Australian economy badly. Unless we see a massive boost to infrastructure which the contracts will more than likely go to the foreign corporations who don’t pay income tax, and the fofo bird will go around in the same circle again until it disappears up its own arse.
    We are in urgent need of a fresh approach, even Bill Shorten is beginning to look good in comparison to this mob of thieves and con men, we need the federal opposition to be much more ‘in your face’ with their alternate policies because the anger is growing in Australia where we see so many social problems like homelessness not being dealt with by this anti-people government that it makes one sick to the stomach, this extreme right wing approach simply cannot continue,this is Australia, not nazi Germany.

  8. Andreas Bimba

    The neo-liberal political class are certainly telling us lies that this nation cannot afford universal free education, healthcare, other social support services and first rate infrastructure. The revenue side of the equation such as chronic tax evasion and overly generous tax concessions have greatly affected the federal budget. For example the superannuation contributions deductions that disproportionately benefit the wealthiest cost the federal budget about the same as the aged pension and it is rising rapidly. The negative gearing concession and 50% CGT concession also disproportionately benefit the wealthiest and cost the federal budget tens of billions.

    Add to this that the MMT economists have proven that the federal government can spend considerably more than it taxes before real resources such as labour supply starts becoming tight and more expensive and inflation becomes excessive, shows the hollowness of the arguments of our neo-liberal duopoly.

  9. Kaye Lee

    Harquebus,

    Thank you. Of all the things we have argued about, of all the things you have said to me, of all the things you have accused me of, that hurt the most. Well it didn’t actually hurt, it just pissed me off. Every person has things they are good at – maths is mine. I am shitful at many things, some of which I will never be interested in (like domestic duties and mountain climbing), but most of which I am thirsty to learn about.

    There are people who are smarter than me at maths but it has been my living. My part-time job at uni was as a bookmaker’s clerk without the use of calçulators or computers. When a horse was 13 to 8 and someone who knew nothing walked up counting out their change to eagerly place $7 each way on it I wanted to scream. Or the ones that would want to put $1 on a horse that was 10 to 1 on.

    Ahhhh the things that come back to you….anyhoo, thanks for the recognition of the one thing I pride myself on.

    PS If you think I’m good at arithmetic, you should see me at calculus 😉

  10. halfbreeder

    townsvilleblog. There are 450K 457 visa currently operative in Australia, The 95,000 you quoted is just this or last years issue. Each visa goes for 4 years so you are leaving out the visa granted in the previous three years in your quote.

    silkworm. Kaye is highlighting the contradictory logic in the government’s own discourse and using their inconsistent logic to highlight deficiencies in their policy and not necessarily adopting an anti-MMT approach in her analysis and criticism. I see nothing wrong with her approach. In fact, I think it is a sound argument practice for her to do that and that it is necessary as a starting point in any criticism.

    Fact is Morrison is now a Magician and will make the debt or most of it disappear with the wave of his magical pen and a few magic spells. ‘Abracadabra…debt be gone’. He is now well and truly a demi-god and shaman of the highest order with the ability to make material things disappear into thin air. He is bordering on a miracle worker and the messiah to a whole nation. LOL..

  11. Matters Not

    It will be interesting to see the language employed by government when differentiating between ‘good’ and ‘bad’ debt, particularly in light of their favoured ‘household analogy’. I suspect a major de-coupling will be required

    Take expenditure on education/schooling/university as an example. Perhaps we will see feats of mental gymnastics with – government outgoings in that area seen as ‘bad’ debt but individual expenditures conceptualised as ‘good’ debt because for an individual it is after all an ‘investment’.

    Perhaps ‘investment’ will acquire a few different meanings?

  12. PK

    Just remember taxes do not fund Federal Government spending… the purpose of tax is to maintain market stability and to stop inflation by taking money out of the economy… tax in essence destroys money. Don’t fall into using the same flawed argumentdriven by neoliberalism ideology that they do, it will only maintain the status quo and get is no where… instead you need to argue that the Government as the sole and only creator and issuer of the Australian dollar can afford to and has a duty of care towards its citizens… to ensure that they have adequate resources and access to appropriate care… that it is a basic human right and the responsibility of the Government to meet. Anr it is about rime that they stepped up and did their job and STOP with the false and flawed arguments about affordability as that is a flout out lie.

    I have ceased to share articles that promote the FALSE narrative that is driven by neoliberalism on how the economy. As it only continues to support neoliberal views.

    Dr Bill Mitchell – Professor of Economics Taxpayers do not fund anything
    http://bilbo.economicoutlook.net/blog/?p=9281

    Ben Bernanke, Chairman of the Federal Reserve: the government ISN’T SPENDING TAX MONEY
    https://youtu.be/11J_914RZ-o

    Professor L. Randall Wray
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEiNLmg2tYA&index=7&list=PLZJAgo9FgHWZzhpkjtMxIwZns26A0OdFz

    Ellis Willingham
    Federal taxation does NOT pay for federal spending.
    https://www.facebook.com/ellis.winningham/posts/1151361588256021

    Steven Hail lecture of Economics
    https://www.facebook.com/green.modernmoneytheoryandpractice/posts/1076054609144348

  13. Kaye Lee

    It’s like a religious mantra that doesn’t recognise questions. Still no answer on how unlimited (except by productive capacity) government spending would affect the exchange rate and so many other things. Having the capacity to do something requires investigation of the consequences both good and bad.

  14. Matters Not

    Then there’s the realpolitik. Is there just one serving politician from either, or any side, who will out themselves? If not – then why not?

    Better still – a ‘government’? Until then …

  15. Zathras

    Is a HECs debt good or bad debt?
    If it gets you a well-paid and secure job afterwards it was a wise investment and “good debt”.
    If you don’t manage to find a job despite your qualifications it must therefore be a “bad debt” and have been a waste of time as well as money.
    So, is education an expense or an investment – nationally as well as personally?

    Likewise, do hospitals generate “good” or “bad” debt?
    If they result in a healthier and more productive society they must be “good” but because they aren’t profitable they must also be “bad”.
    Perhaps, like Schrodinger’s cat they are both, but depend on political spin requirements at the time.

    It’s all semantics and a distraction at best.

    Governments should have been borrowing for infrastructure years ago but were too politically spooked to do so and now we are all reaping the rewards of their short-sightedness and opportunism.

  16. Florence nee Fedup

    I am fed up hearing tertiary education describe as a privilege, luxury for young people. Something they should pay for.

    Truth is, our society, economy won’t function without highly educated, trained and skilled population. That is university graduates among others.

    All of society benefit from students. All should pay. Especially employers, who no longer train any workers. Something they did in the past.

    Would take on young school leavers in factories and offices with aim of skilling them into senior positions. No longer occurs as far as I know.

  17. babyjewels10

    You’ve no idea what a relief it is to read something that makes sense, isn’t trying to pull the wool over my eyes or insult my intelligence! Thank you Kaye Lee.

  18. Matters Not

    Why is 12 Years of schooling seen as a social ‘good’ while the following X Years seen only in terms of an individual ‘good’? To complicate matters, why is the X Years still seen to be a social ‘good’ in some nations but not in others? The most obvious examples are the US and Germany.

    In the US, companies are reluctant to invest in the average worker for fear (that once skilled) they will leave and go to another company which will then be the beneficiary. In contrast, Germany is prepared to invest in workers and accepts there will be swings and roundabouts. But there will be a skilled population – with people learning from each other.

    Why is Australia determined to proceed down the US route.? Germany gives us Merkel while the US gives us …

    Yes, too simple I know.

  19. diannaart

    One of our most valuable renewable resources are people; our health, welfare, education and support are necessary for this nation to continue as a wealth first world nation. Which we are not doing. Instead businesses claim they can’t find workers, the government slices more off our education budget daily, wages have stagnated and our leaders pretend shock because people can’t save enough of their hard-earned for a deposit on a house.

    Instead we have parrots for politicians who want Australia to slouch towards the quagmire of inequality that is the USA today.

    I have debt. Most of it I would call ‘good’ debt because it is debt for the home in which I live. The equity is far more than my debt. I also look after my home as best as I can, because caring for something or someone is a positive investment.

    The healthier, better educated and secure people feel, the more productive they are. It is not rocket science it’s not even maths.

    But no-one is listening.

  20. Florence nee Fedup

    Debt within itself can’t be bad. It is an essential component of our economical system. It is how debt is used and handled that counts.

  21. John Kelly

    Someday, some time in the future, people will realise that a currency issuing nation does not need either taxes or borrowings to finance spending in its own currency. A currency issuer cannot owe itself money. It can always buy services that are available for sale in its own currency. Why this is so difficult to grasp, is beyond me. Health, education and welfare are services a currency issuer can finance without resource to taxation or borrowing.

  22. Mark Needham

    Kaye, I really think, you show the fact that you do know your place.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w

    Really is unbecoming of the new generation of MSinformation.
    What Oh.
    Mark Needham

  23. Ross

    I think I’ve grasped the nub of Morrison logic.
    Good debt = $1 billion to fund Adani rail line. (Never mind stranded mine asset, it’s really a gift to Gina)
    Bad debt = Any money having to be spent on the ordinary Australian citizen, schools hospitals etc.
    Simple logic for a simple mind.

  24. paul walter

    Determined to shove the Murdoch/IPA agenda down the public’s throat, regardless of unfairness or harm done.

    It’s not real economics, just crank ideology/theology based on wanky prejudice and faulty value judgements about people and life.

  25. totaram

    Kaye Lee:
    The exchange rate is dependent on what is going on in other nations relative to us. As such, a faster growing economy here would tend to attract investment, as we saw during the mining boom. In addition, very low interest rates in the rest of the world and higher interest rates here again attracted investment and raised the AUD. But how should that have any relevance to govt. fiscal policy, which is basically what govt. spending is about? We, as a nation, deal with the consequences of exchange rate fluctuations already in a number of ways.

  26. Kronomex

    “No problem, says Morriscum. “We’ll just put it on the credit and when Labor gets in we’ll conveniently forget that we sank the country and start a new round of blaming Labor.”
    “What a boffo jape that will be to play on them.” replies Mal Feasance as he tickles Duncehead under the chin.

  27. Harquebus

    “A currency issuer cannot” create energy, food and other resources the same way that currency is created. This MMT thingy is nothing more than absurd attempt to the continue the theft by our governments of society’s time and labour.

    “This is the shabby secret of the welfare statists’ tirades against gold. Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights. If one grasps this, one has no difficulty in understanding the statists’ antagonism toward the gold standard.” — Alan Greenspan

    Cheers.

  28. John Kelly

    Harquebus, you are right. A currency issuer cannot create energy, food and other resources. And it can run out of resources. That is a fundamental principle of MMT. It cannot, however, run out of money. If it runs out of resources, its currency would be worthless.

  29. Andreas Bimba

    What the MMT economists have realised is that taxes and debt are not even needed to fund the federal government’s spending as all federal government spending is money creation. Similarly all taxation extinguishes money. Taxes of a similar magnitude to currently are however still needed so as to avoid inflation and for wealth redistribution purposes.

    The end result is that generally speaking the federal government can net spend (deficit spend) considerably more than currently without any debt being incurred.

  30. totaram

    ““This is the shabby secret of the welfare statists’ tirades against gold. Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights. If one grasps this, one has no difficulty in understanding the statists’ antagonism toward the gold standard.” — Alan Greenspan”

    Complete hypocrisy by the well-known exponent of the “Greenspan put”. In all his years as the chairman of the Fed when did he ask for a restoration of the gold standard?”

    Notice the quote is directed mainly against the “welfare statists”, those very same guys in northern Europe who were doing quite well until they started believing the neocon lies.

    If we are going for quote mining, we can go on and on. The point is: how has deficit spending confiscated wealth? No evidence whatsoever. Complete fabrication. Standard neoliberal lies about deficits fuelling inflation etc.

  31. Win jeavons

    To see costs of education as” bad debt” makes me furious !! Training for teaching or nursing or other essential jobs never will make one wealthy, but show me one nation that can do without them. This mob of incompetents should 1 pay for their degrees at projected rates, 2 be fined and sacked forced to live on Newstart and the age pension for the rest of their miserable lives !

  32. Royce Arriso

    Totaram and John Kelly–spot on, as usual. Amazed to see the ‘taxes fund expenditure’ line pushed. It’s the thin end of a Neoliberal wedge which ends reinforcing that cobwebbed myth so dear to those with an inflated sense of their own importance—“my taxes fund unemployed druggies and women who have too many kids.”
    It is complete crap.

  33. Harquebus

    Another comment disappears down theAIMN rabbit hole. Will a moderator please check if it is still there.
    Thanking you in advance.
    Cheers.

  34. Harquebus

    John Kelly
    Finite resources are diminishing. From your comment, fiat currencies in MMT will continue to lose value, as is the case today on their way to worthlessness.

    totaram
    The maestro changed his tune when it became his watch eh? Putting his reputation ahead of pragmatism.

    How has deficit spending confiscated wealth?

    “At a delicatessen counter in eastern Caracas, Humberto Gonzalez removes slices of salty white cheese from his scale and replaces them with a stack of bolivar notes handed over by his customer. It’s sad,” Gonzalez says. “At this point, I think the cheese is worth more.””Sadly, Venezuela is the canary in the coalmine for what will happen to all currencies in a world where there is now simply too much debt.”
    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-31/i-feel-pablo-escobar-venezuelans-resort-weighing-cash-hyperinflation-builds

    “Now Venezuela is running out of money. Actual money. As in banknotes. The country can no longer afford the pieces of paper which represent the money it doesn’t have.”
    https://fee.org/articles/venezuela-cant-afford-to-print-more-money/

    Search criteria: venezuela afford to print currency

    No evidence whatsoever? Complete fabrication?

    Note: Venezuela has the world’s largest oil reserves and its currency is almost worthless.

    theAIMN
    Don’t worry about going down the rabbit hole.

    Cheers.

  35. Kaye Lee

    Venezuela seems a rather unique case in that it borrowed heavily from China and Russia and agreed to pay them back in oil. They have had distribution problems which means they aren’t supplying oil to their cash paying customers like India and the US and so the issue spirals down. They kicked out the companies that had the resources and equipment to develop their oil reserves.

  36. stephengb2014

    Kaye Lee
    I cannot answer your question with any assurance but my understanding is that the Exchange rate for any currency is based entirely on the confidence that the buyer/seller has about that particular currency,. In other words the value of any currency is the value according to the currency stock market at any given time.

    The general stock market value of any particular stock ebbs with the confidence that the buyers and sellers have on that stock, and of course that is dependent on intelligence gathering and speculation and confidence, so too it is with currency, on the currency market.

    The exchange rate does not impact us unless you play on the money market or you want to change the currency you are holding into Australian dollars.

    Oh and the exchange rate does not impact Australian dollars for those countries that have imported goods because they sell goods to us in Australian dollars in other words the rate of exchange is their problem, just as they buy from us in theeir currency the rate of exchange of their currency is our problem.
    But what actually happens is those countries and we, have accounts at ours and their Central Banks and those accounts are just adjusted as goods to and from each country.

    Having said all that I urge you to do what you do best and research the answer via Billy Blogg.
    Proffessor Bill Mitchell uses his blogg to explain almost every aspect of MMT macr-economics.

    Regards
    S

  37. Kaye Lee

    It seems budget changes will link university funding to success in completion rates, student satisfaction and employment outcomes. How on earth can that work? Give everyone a credit so they progress on happily? What responsibility does the government take in making sure there are jobs to be had? Do overseas jobs count because that’s where many of our science and engineering graduates are forced to head.

  38. Kaye Lee

    stephen, the exchange rate affects the price of imports and the price of overseas travel. It affects how much industries get for their exports.

    I have read a great deal of Bill Mitchell’s work. It is very heavy going. I generally understand the rationale behind MMT but it really needs better communicators. It is just silly to say taxes destroy money when they are actually deposited into an account at the RBA. You could say they reduce private spending capacity perhaps and you can say they do not confine the government’s ability to spend, but this destruction rhetoric makes no sense to me.

  39. totaram

    Kaye Lee: Next they will mention Zimbabwe and then hark back to the Weimar republic. Showing no understanding of macro-economics at all.
    The simple counter-example is Japan. The govt debt is 200% of GDP and there is no inflation worth mentioning. Govt. deficits do not always lead to inflation. Period. There are other factors that lead to inflation as you have pointed out. In particular borrowing in other people’s currencies leads to problems. Most importantly, as mentioned any number of times, it is the collapse of production that leads to demand outstripping supply. Yes, there is no evidence that deficit financing always leads to inflation. And Japan, Australia, and USA today, prove that point. Venezuela has special problems. But it is all too much for H, who talks glibly of the laws of physics and energy, but would be hard put to distinguish between energy and enthalpy, for a start. Like Freethinker I have learned my lesson and do not engage with H. directly. But bullshit argument needs to be called out for what it is.

  40. Harquebus

    totarum
    Thank you for adding a new word to my vocabulary. Appreciated.
    “The simple counter-example is Japan. The govt debt is 200% of GDP and there is no inflation worth mentioning.”
    This is a terrible situation from which Japan has no hope of extracting itself.
    There is no connection between economics and physics. To compare one with the other is like comparing voodoo to modern medicine.

    Ah, QandA. Must go.

    Cheers.

  41. Matters Not

    KL at 9.17 – why stop with awarding ‘credits’? Why not aim higher – and award Distinctions. But don’t stop there – award Hig … That would be irrefutable evidence that things are improving. While once, most students would achieve a Pass grading, now most students are awarded … just look at the ‘evidence’ of improvement.

    But perhaps not?

    That Universities should be primarily focussed on ‘producing’ students (like sausages) for work misses the point of what education should, or might, be about. If work preparation is the only aim, then do away with Universities all together and just send students to a ‘training’ institute.

    After all it’s much cheaper. And besides the historical evidence suggests the ‘trained’ are much more compliant than the ‘educated’.

  42. Kronomex

    Cut the taxpayers dollars to the private school sector by half…not bloody likely! The catholic church is always the first to scream the loudest when that idea is raised and the LNP (and Labor) buckles to their strident cries all while they continue to ship their tax free dollars back to the vatican. Yes, I intentionally removed the capital letters.

  43. Zathras

    I thought the whole point of living in a civilised society was that you could be kept safe, healthy and be educated enough to make on ongoing contribution for it to continue and prosper.

    I also recall a time when governments could afford to pay for things like schools, hospitals, roads and all the other infrastructure required by its citizens.

    Now, despite a long period of continual and increasing prosperity it seems that these are the very things that can no longer be afforded because revenue it being cut to create a more prosperous business environment for “trickle down purposes” and to simply further enrich a tiny proportion of the society at the expense of the rest.
    We have to establish our own private charities to make up for the constant shortfalls in services that we used to pay for.

    It was once jokingly said that Australia was destined to be “a farm, a quarry and a nice place to visit” and would eventually become the “poor white trash of Asia”. Nobody seems to be laughing.

  44. Kaye Lee

    Emma Alberici interviewed Cormann last night and asked him if spending $50 billion to build submarines that we could have bought for $30 billion was good debt as the submarines didn’t create any income and weren’t an asset that could be sold. Cormann went straight to script saying because they last for several decades it was a good investment. Could I point out that education lasts a lifetime and contributes to the whole society. When asked what was bad debt, Cormann said we have to be able to pay for our recurrent expenditure out of revenue. Well guess what Matthias, we can. I so wish Alberici had said that using the budget figures as proof.

    I don’t usually comment on someone’s appearance but do you think Cormann has had Botox? His eyebrows never move. His forehead never crinkles. It could be because he doesn’t have to think about or consider anything he is asked because he just reads from a script – no thought involved.

  45. wam

    when the rabbott was screaming about gillard’s 25% debt being a disaster, japan 200% poms and many countries 100+% did labor or anyone counter by asking what the rabbott would call those countries? Why? Do we hear little billy reminding us of the AAA under LABOR?? Why do you know something, Kaye, that would excite the media but labor doesn’t?

    When will bill ask question about pyne’s materiel????

  46. Nantes

    Zathras “nobody seems to be laughing”
    I’d say the 1% / rentier class are laughing all the way to the bank.
    I posted this on another thread but in a few short minutes the message is clear as – Professor Michael Hudson, author of ‘J is for Junk Economics’ describes the agenda (start @ 6.50) – Cheat, Lie & Steal: Michael Hudson on the Capitalist Way:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZM0_7PVuVVg

  47. Frank Smith

    Kaye Lee, i missed the Cormann interview last night – I should be more thruthful and acknowledge that I have given up watching this automon. How many times did he resort to his favorite Cormannism “obviously obvious”? On his Botox, maybe it is because he is actually a robot!

  48. helvityni

    For the same reason, Frank, I did not watch the Lateline…I don’t know about Botox, but his face seems to take all the space on the screen; on the positive side his Labor blaming puts me to sleep….
    It’s healthier to watch Cormann, Dutton raises my blood pressure.

  49. Kaye Lee

    Cormann reminds me of a a doll I had with a string in its back who had a small stock of phrases that it would repeat over and over. Of course, he has had to be reprogrammed to stop saying “Laybor’s debt and deficit disaster”. It is now called “the mess”.

    Here’s the interview if you can be bothered.

    http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2016/s4661987.htm

  50. helvityni

    Kaye, oh no, not a doll but a ROBOT, a black and white one ,right up to his tie !

    I tried to imitate his pronunciation of Labor, thanks for Laybor… 🙂

  51. Harquebus

    “Environmentalist David Suzuki hits the nail on the head.”
    “Economics is a form of brain damage”
    https://rwer.wordpress.com/2017/04/30/economics-is-a-form-of-brain-damage/

    1: Forget economics. It is “fatally” flawed. It has polluted the planet, poisoned us all, does not factor physics nor the environment and is what has got us into this mess in the first place.

    Cheers.

  52. diannaart

    H

    You only select what maintains your belief system.

    David Suzuki provides a wealth of scientifically backed information. Thought of opening the doors of your perception?

    http://www.davidsuzuki.org/issues/

    … and stuff about GOOD debt

    https://onestepoffthegrid.com.au/victoria-investigates-potential-solar-pumped-hydro-former-mining-centres/

    http://www.global-economic-symposium.org/knowledgebase/the-global-economy/effective-investments-in-education

    … and people who are walking the talk – rather than spending vast amounts of time arguing with people who don’t agree 100% with them

    https://onestepoffthegrid.com.au/find-a-professional/

    You claim to read widely – yet your comments do not reflect your claims.

  53. jimhaz

    @ Nantes
    Good video…so true to me. Such a pity that the rich have taken over both sides of politics.

    I now think the ALP under Rudd was wrong to save us from a recession. We must let these recessions occur.

  54. Harquebus

    diannaart
    Yes, I do select articles that support my views or that I think others will be interested in from a wide variety of articles read. Many such as one that you posted are potential solutions. Recently, I read and posted one about a failed pumped hydro project. Forgive me for not sharing your optimism.
    It’s a bit hard to argue with someone who agrees.
    Thank you for the links.
    Cheers.

  55. Nantes

    jimhaz, agree, the whole video is worth watching (15mins).
    The Enlightenment 200-300 years ago heralded a swing to freedom and equality for all but now it’s looking like those in power wish to reverse all gains. The propaganda unit facilitating this reversal is the MSM. MSM analysis of almost any situation is rubbish.
    In the words of one PM ‘It’s never been a better time to be an Australian ignoring the MSM’.

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