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Old King Coal And Adani!

I almost bought The Australian today, but I stopped myself and figured that I could either look it up on-line and if that failed, simply go back to the supermarket where I saw the headline about anti-coal activists driving India away and take a photo of the article with my phone. I mean, it was near the self-service department, so it wasn’t like there’d be any staff there to object.

Mm, ya gotta wonder about these self-service things… How many more before there’s nobody left working? As Henry Ford is reported to have said when he was shown an all-automated factory, “But who’d be left to buy the cars?”

Now, if you’ve read my previous blogs on Adani, you’ll know that I think that it’s more likely that Angelina will ring me and say that she’s heard about my writing and she’d like to meet me, than the proposed mine going ahead. I base it on two pieces of evidence in the public domain:

1. Thermal coal is at such low prices that people are closing existing mines, so how could it be a commercial proposition to set up a new mine? I am aware that there has been a bit of resurgence in the price of coking coal, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that it’s going to lead to a spike in the price of thermal coal. Neither can we be sure that the recent increase will be sustainable in the long term.

2. More importantly, India has announced its intention to cease imports of thermal coal by 2017/18. Not only that, they’ve recently stated that they’re on track to do so.

However, it seems that Adani may not go ahead, not – amazingly – because of the reasons I just mentioned, but because of the activists.

According to “The Australian”:

‘A highly orchest­rated, secretly foreign-funded group of Australian environ­mental activists ­oppos­ing the $16 billion Adani coalmine in Queensland has “dampened” ­Indian investment interest in Australia and received heated criticism from the federal Coalition and Queensland Labor governments.

‘Indian Power Minister Piyush Goyal told The Australian yesterday the years of legal challenges to the vast Carmichael coal project, now revealed to have been funded by multi-million-dollar foundations in the US, “will certainly dampen future investments” from India.

‘Federal ministers and the Queensland Premier, Annastacia Palaszczuk, have warned of the danger posed by activists to jobs and investment, and questioned the links between the Australian groups, through their US funders, to the chairman of Hillary Clinton’s Democratic election campaign, John Podesta.’

I’ll spare you the quotes from Tony Abbott and others, because they’re predictable and embarrassing. The point, of course, is that we’re now being softened up in much the same way that Trump is softening up his supporters. When he loses, it won’t be because he ran a terrible campaign. He told us: “Make America Grate Again!” – unaware of the obvious pun about any country with him as leader would be sure to grate. No, it’ll be because the election was rigged and he never had a chance. (Imagine his reaction if the roles were reversed and Hillary was complaining about Fox News…)

When the announcement comes that Adani is pulling out, it won’t be because the economics just don’t add up. No, it’ll be because of those “activists”. And they’re getting money from overseas. Terrible. We should have a Royal Commission into where their funds came from because it’s alleged that they came from the USA. We can’t have bodies being funded from overseas. What do you mean tell us where the IPA gets its money? That’s a private body and it’s none of your business.

Of course, I could be wrong. The government may announce that they’ve suddenly found a spare few billion just to aid development in the North and how better to spend it than by giving it to an Indian company because we don’t have concerns about giving money to non-Australians; we only have concerns about people who aren’t Australian if they’re funding “activists” because Australians who disagree with government policy have no business being active about it.

However, given The Australian‘s article, I tend to suspect that we’ll probably have an announcement some time soon about Adani pulling out. First, of course, we’ll have more articles about “vigilante litigation” (now there’s an oxymoron, if there ever was one!), as well as a couple of stories linking the funding of activists groups to organisations from overseas or unions, followed by the odd editorial about how anyone opposing the mine is an inner city latte-sipping bearded hipster on welfare who’s also a member of a bikie gang.

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  1. Clean livin

    Hey Rosleigh, “the Australian” comes in handy when nature calls in the bush, and that is really all it is good for.

    You will have difficulty doing that with an electronic photo!

  2. Adrianne Haddow

    I wonder if the Adani company heard from their friend Gina that the Australian government was giving away money in the form of subsidies for mining with the added benefit of no taxes needing to be paid for minerals plundered, and decided ‘hey what a great way to fund the renewable energy infrastructure that we will build in Southern India’.
    Are we suckers, or not?

  3. Kaye Lee

    “The Adani project is Indian resource nationalism combined with Bjelke-Petersen-style crackpot economics that privileges development over economic gain.

    Ms Palaszczuk might as well be throwing bananas at the US lobbyists for all of the economic sense that she’s making.”

    Resisting Adani is good resources policy

  4. Kaye Lee

    The Carmichael mine is part of a larger plan to develop five megamines in the Galilee Basin. The economics of the rail line and port expansion needed to transport coal from Carmichael depend on the assumption that the costs will be shared across these mines.

    But these projects are in far worse straits than Adani’s. GVK, the Indian conglomerate that owns the Alpha, Kevin’s Corner and Alpha West deposits, is in deep financial trouble. Its Australian partners, Aurizon (the privatised Queensland Rail) and Hancock Prospecting (owned by Gina Rinehart), have written off their investments. GVK’s March 2016 financial statements did not even mention the Galilee Basin assets.

    GVK looks healthy compared to the other major owner of Galilee Basin assets, Clive Palmer. In a desperate attempt to stave off the bankruptcy of his Queensland Nickel corporation, he tried to offload the coal deposits owned by his Waratah Coal company onto Adani, and use the mooted sale proceeds to secure credit from Aurizon. Neither party was interested.

    https://theconversation.com/adani-should-bow-out-gracefully-from-its-carmichael-coal-mine-64608

  5. kerri

    The self service thingy? My (Uni student) daughter, assures me that as far as self scanning is concerned, her friends are all on a strict “carrot only” diet. No avocadoes or pomegranates whatsoever. But the big twos reaction to the self scanning scam is a good metaphor for the tramways sacking of conductors. They sack the people keeping the system honest and hand over to the public on trust. Then when the public cheat, coz hey why not?, they employ more people to “police” the cheats!

  6. 4fun

    Hey, CleanLiving, the AustralIan is no longer good for butt wiping. They saved money by going to cheap ink that easily comes of the paper. Beware butts!

  7. Matters Not

    might as well be throwing bananas at the US lobbyists for all of the economic sense that she’s making

    Can only agree re the lack of ‘economic sense’ but Ms Palaszczuk is a politician and for her it makes perfect ‘political sense’. Her ‘knife edge’ government needs support from key ‘independents’ to survive. At times, for example, she needs the vote of Robbie Katter whose ‘vision’ includes more rail lines (in the vain hope) to bring more prosperity to remote parts of Queensland. Why would Ms Palaszczuk rain on his tea party? Why would she crush his hopes and dreams? There’s certainly no political mileage down that track, – only tears.

    The Carmichael mine is now but a pipedream. Adani needs financial backing and to date the banks are running away, almost with indecent haste. Which bank wants stranded assets on the books? Simply it isn’t going to happen. Sure there’s been a ‘spike’ in the price of coal but that’s easily explained by the Chinese government’s over enthusiasm in closing down mines to reduce carbon emissions while they transition to other arrangements.

    Coal is so yesterday. Palaszczuk knows it. The banks know it. Adani knows it. Why open new mines when there are so many existing mines that can be purchased so very, very cheaply? But then again, Palaszczuk can’t destroy the hopes and dreams of others without destroying her own government.

  8. Trish Corry

    I think Adani will go ahead for the following reasons:
    6.1% unemployment in QLD
    up to 35.8% youth unemployment in some areas of QLD
    Rockhampton already being identified and applied for as a ‘Hub’ for workers
    The flow on effects for all other small businesses and suppliers will be very positive.
    Project Jobs already being advertised
    140 strict environmental conditions imposed
    Advances in Coal mining with QLD having some of the best clean coal environmental practices

    To say QLD has not done a lot of work in innovation in mining practices and environmental protections for its largest export product; is a slap in the face for QLDers.

    To disregard a major project such as this, that can bring huge jobs growth to the region, whilst doing everything possible to minimise environmental impacts and carbon emissions (QLD has already invested millions in carbon reduction) treats regional QLDers like we are idiots. It also treats us like we don’t deserve job opportunities and a decent quality of life.

    I do get annoyed with people who just fob this off without any other consideration of the impact the downturn in mining has had on the region where I live. I do believe that a balanced approach can be achieved and I do believe the QLD Govt does take environmental considerations seriously. To claim Palaszczuk is an environmental vandal as I have heard some do (usually Greens voters who live outside of QLD) is absolutely ludicrous.

    I find it really hurtful and quite distressing that some people would rather some towns in regional QLD turn into ghost towns and the people in those communities really, truly suffer and then in the larger regional towns feel the real brunt of that as well; rather than consider for one second that a balanced approach is achievable.

    There are many people who are under the assumption that the mine is right on the Great Barrier Reef. The mine is about three and a half to four hours by car from the Great Barrier Reef. There is no direct impact on the reef from the mine. The impact is from sediment (which will be strictly controlled) and Carbon emissions (which also have control measures with innovation occurring in this space all the time.)

    I have faith in the QLD Labor Government to manage this well for good outcomes. I understand that there are other hurdles before it is finalised, but I believe it will go ahead.

    I am not a huge fan of mining for many reasons; but until there is a transitional plan in place to achieve proper jobs growth in other industries, mining in this region is essential for jobs and the QLD economy. So if you want to advocate – advocate to the Government to develop a plan for the regions for decentralisation of the public sector, incentives for manufacturers to start businesses and alternative energy projects and a change to local community orgs running community agencies – instead of large orgs like Salvo’s getting preferences and changes to local tender and supplier practices for Govt.

    I never hear people say any of this when they discuss why Adani should not go ahead – because no one actually cares about regional QLD and jobs.

  9. Jennifer Meyer-Smith

    Trish,

    despite your remarkable attempts to appear balanced and reasonable, you prove yourself a Labor lackey yet again, who puts individual workers’ jobs above the environmental consequences of their actions and the industry whilst ignoring the bigger picture of alternative and diverse employment with innovative and alternative industries.

    I know you are frustrated in Queensland by the lack of brainpower to find alternatives but you don’t have to buckle under to the bottom line pressure.

    And don’t think you alone experience that frustration.

    Many here know that insurmountable frustration – without bowing to the central body that only pretends to care.
    Sorry Shorten if that offends!

  10. Matters Not

    TC also provides the political rationale but it’s all in vain. While the ‘politics’ are sound, the economics and the environmental considerations simply don’t add up.

    Not going to happen. Wishin and hopin …

  11. Michael Taylor

    Jennifer, please, let’s not have any fighting.

  12. Jennifer Meyer-Smith

    Ok Michael.

  13. Trish Corry

    Jennifer. It’s OK. I know you don’t give me a pat on the head and a cookie like you do to your Labor hating faves. Don’t fret. I’m sure I’ll live.

    I’ll go sit in the naughty corner for caring about jobs and the economy within a balanced approach. You know, jobs – those things that give us a quality of life and a good standard of living and lift people out of poverty sometimes even breaking generational poverty. My bad. Bad Trish. Bad!!!!

    You also always try to make out supporting Labor is like something that is really bad. Highly amusing behaviour.

  14. Trish Corry

    Matters Not. If you take note of my last few paragraphs and people started actually caring about regional QLD and started advocating for real solutions, instead of just complaining and whining with the only solution to destroy job opportunities – we could be on the way to an better solution that will be better for the long term environmental goals. The way people talk human beings in CQ just don’t exist and do no matter at all. I get rather annoyed with the entire thing.

  15. Matters Not

    TC, yes I care about CQ and the people affected, but why give them false hopes. That’s only going to add to their problems in the longer term. It’s not about destroying job opportunities – the truth is they are simply not there and will not be there if we go down this track.

    If you like I could give any number of links to why coal has a limited future and why new mines are simply not on. But maybe one.

    http://www.michaelwest.com.au/category/energy/

    Don’t CQ people deserve to know that their future is not with coal?

  16. Trish Corry

    Matters Not. Please don’t assume that the people of QLD don’t understand coal is limited. However, until there are other viable transitional measures to create jobs (which will take time and investment and a complete shift in thinking of City vs Regional and a lot of advocacy) – we need mining to continue in a form that is as environmentally friendly as it can be. To give us nothing until all these things come into play and are realistic and ‘here’ then it is treating regional QLDers with platitudes and contempt, in my opinion.

  17. Matters Not

    TC, mining will continue and therefore some miners will have continued employment, although the number of operating mines will decline and the prospect of new mines is simply not on the ‘reality’ radar. The prospects are grim.

    I note tonight on the ABC news that houses in Collinsville are being traded for a song, with ‘grey nomads’ buying ‘dirt cheap’. Even the ‘rigs’ they travel in are worth more than the houses just bought. That’s the reality. But that grim reality isn’t just confined to regional towns. Things aren’t looking too bright in the cities also

    As for what might be done, … ???

    At a macro level we need to change our thinking re jobs (difficult I know), UBI must be on the radar.

  18. Trish Corry

    There is a huge difference in available trade jobs now and say six years ago. The flow on and sustainability for other businesses – large and small is really felt. It impacts on so much. Unless you live in an area that has been impacted by the loss of a significant industry – you will not understand. You need to live it. You need to feel it. You need to see the despair. You need to understand the loss of hope and the fear and anxiety for not just jobs for adults, but jobs for kids when they leave school.

    We are still recovering, not just from mining downturn, the flow on effects from that for large and small suppliers and contractors, but the huge cuts to public sector jobs from Campbell Newman and the cyclone impact doesn’t go away over night. For some businesses and families they take a huge hit. If people aren’t in jobs and consumers aren’t spending – then new businesses also shy away. It is a vicious circle. Family and friend units are broken up as people move away.

    Plus Bligh sold the railway – a major employer here, which will always be absolutely unforgivable. That utter distaste and upset about that will be with me until the day I die.

    There is an opportunity here with this mine, with every measure taken seriously to lessen the impact, but even after all the above, we can’t have that opportunity either, according to many. Go without they yell. That is what I hear. No solutions. Just go without.

    I would expect that once the ramifications of Car Manufacturing are felt down south, there will be so much more empathy, possibly protests and support from the wider commentariate than what there is for regions that have lost mining jobs and associated Industry. There is no empathy for people in this region. None. Rural QLD Youth unemployment is over 35%. How that is less important, I don’t understand.

    From where I sit it seems more important to get some rungs on the board in terms of vocal environmental protest against something, when all factors are not taken into consideration.

    I won’t put the environment before food in mouths. I won’t put the environment before lifting people out of poverty. Unless it is something that is an incredible immediate disaster and a threat to humans. Or a real threat if it was ongoing and ongoing with no solution in sight. There are solutions. There is innovation and continuous improvement and new industry in the future.

    Sorry I’m a shit Greenie. I guess that is the difference between my Laborist values and the values of the Greens followers. Until there are real solutions on offer and they are real in terms of viable obtainable opportunities, then for me, it is jobs and people first. Sorry if people think that is wrong. But I don’t care. Waving a protest sign about the environment doesn’t put food on the table. It doesn’t give our kids careers.

    I have an entire list that could be done to improve things. It is about getting the right people to listen and the right Government getting into power. The things I believe need to happen will not occur under the coalition, only Labor. and QLD can only work as fast as they can after the absolute destruction of Newman. It was bitter and harsh. Economically, Socially, Morally and Spiritually. He is our real life Voldemort.

    Palaszczuk isn’t destroying QLD by supporting the mine. She is saving us.

  19. Matters Not

    TC I hear your pain. But your final claim:

    Palaszczuk isn’t destroying QLD by supporting the mine. She is saving us.

    borders on the ridiculous. From your point of view you have the the right Government … into power and seemingly it’s out of their hands. Unless you are arguing for some type of subsidies that supports ‘stranded assets’?

    As for Bligh, are you aware that Goss closed more railway lines and associated jobs than Bligh ever considered. That Goss commissioned a radical list of school closures that would have changed the face of educational provision across Queensland? (Give Swan his due because it was his intervention when State Secretary that prevented a complete political disaster.) Are you aware that David Hamill stood idly by when the decision was made to destroy ’employment’ in the Ipswich railway workshop – in his own electorate?

    As I have stressed on any number of occasions, developing Labor Policy is a guarantee of nothing when it comes to how a Labor government behaves when it comes to power.

    Political realities are always painful to realise.

  20. Trish Corry

    Bligh destroyed the railway. Goss did not. The Bligh Government’s actions are unforgivable.

    I think you missed the HUGE point I made about Newman. Labor needs at least another term to make real progress. If you are a QLDer, I’m not sure how you don’t get this, if you have lived under Newman.

    As for the rest. I’ll just agree to disagree. I’m off to bed.

  21. Matters Not

    Hopefully a good sleep will make a world of difference. Just for the record, Goss destroyed more railway jobs across Queensland that Bligh ever did.

    As for Newman, I don’t discuss or blame LNP politicians – because it goes without saying that …

  22. Andreas Bimba

    The Queensland government should buy up the electricity network, invest in solar and wind energy in a really big way, forget dinosaur coal, and the electricity sales revenue will pay for it all. This should be simple enough for Queenslander’s to understand but that may be wishful thinking, nope, the wilfully ignorant Queeenslander will probably just move further to the right and vote One Nation – as fossil fuel industry funded – fish and chip shop owners know better.

  23. johnlward010

    The Ecologist

    A new report from the IMF has quantified the prodigious subsidies doled out to the fossil fuel industries, writes Pete Dolack – an astonishing $5.6 trillion per year, over 7% of world product, including direct payments, tax breaks and unpaid environmental costs. The obscene scale of public largesse proves the need for a social movement to challenge global energy capitalism.

    With increased corporate globalization, capital can pick up and move at will, inducing political office holders to hand out subsidies, waive taxes and refuse to enforce safety and environmental laws.
    Most of the cost of fossil fuels is hidden because environmental harms such as pollution and global warming are kept outside ordinary economic calculation. Energy companies externalize these costs (among others) – that is, they don’t pay them. The public does.

    And we do, to a remarkable extent. When we think of corporate subsidies, we naturally think of taxes not paid, real estate giveaways and other ways of taking money from the public and shoveling it into corporate coffers.

    Then there are the environmental costs, something prominent if we are talking about fossil fuels. These, too, should be thought of as subsidies since these constitute costs paid by the public.

    A first attempt at seriously quantifying the magnitude of the totality of subsidies given to fossil fuels leads to a conclusion that the total for 2014 was US$5.6 trillion, a total expected to be matched in 2015.

    Yes, you read that correctly: 5.6 trillion dollars. As in $5.6 million million. Or, to put it another way, more than seven percent of gross world product. A lot of money.

    IMF report: ‘huge benefits’ from eliminating fossil fuel subsidies

    These calculations are, interestingly, the product of an International Monetary Fund working paper, ‘How Large Are Global Energy Subsidies?’

    The paper, prepared by economists David Coady, Ian Parry, Louis Sears and Baoping Shang, sought to provide a fuller accounting of the costs of the environmental damages caused by fossil fuels, and found that those costs greatly exceed direct corporate subsidies and below-cost consumer pricing. The authors foresee huge benefits should all fossil-fuel subsidies be eliminated. They write:

    “Eliminating post-tax subsidies in 2015 could raise government revenue by $2.9 trillion (3.6 percent of global GDP), cut global CO₂ emissions by more than 20 percent, and cut pre-mature air pollution deaths by more than half. After allowing for the higher energy costs faced by consumers, this action would raise global economic welfare by $1.8 trillion (2.2 percent of global GDP).”

  24. Trish Corry

    Matters Not. I could not go to bed without finding the exact figures on this. Under Goss job losses were 250 – a huge backlash occurred and he ceased his plan of cutting 550 jobs. He closed 2,800 km of rail track. The main workshop job losses were in Ipswich and centralised to Brisbane.

    3000 job losses have occurred since Bligh sold QR. This is irreversible damage. This is different than Goss. The state was still in control and could re-instate if they so desired. You don’t get that opportunity once it is gone. To privatise the state transport company I can only describe it as a demented decision.

    and what did QLD do when he did this, and tried to sell Suncorp? Booted him out.

    Our Assets are not for sale.

    I reassure you, I will still be a Labor voter and Labor member after a good night’s sleep any night of the week.

  25. Kaye Lee

    FOUR jobs have been advertised with Adani Australia jobs- one being a senior project engineer for solar renewables.

    According to an Adani spokesman this would be to work on one of two solar projects it had in the pipeline, one in South Australia and one in Central Queensland.

    The Central Queensland one could be up to 150MW in scale.

    http://www.qt.com.au/news/jobs-now-advertised-with-adani-australia/3100826/

    Meanwhile in India….

    Adani Green Energy, part of the Adani Group, today said it has dedicated to the nation the world’s largest 648-mw solar power plant in Tamil Nadu entailing an investment of Rs 4,550 crore.

    “The plant is set up at Kamuthi, Ramanathapuram, in Tamil Nadu with an investment of Rs 4,550 crore. It is part of the state government’s ambitious target of generating 3,000 mw as per the solar energy policy unveiled by the government in 2012,” it said.

    “This is a momentous occasion for Tamil Nadu as well as for the entire country. We are… happy to dedicate this plant to the nation. A plant of this magnitude reinstates the country’s ambitions of becoming one of the leading green energy producers in the world,” said Gautam Adani, Chairman, Adani Group.

    http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/delhi/Adani-unveils-worlds-largest-solar-power-plant-in-Tamil-Nadu/articleshow/54444571.cms

    These are the jobs of the future

  26. Kaye Lee

    The rehabilitation of abandoned mines could create thousands of jobs in areas hit hard by the resources downturn, according to a new report.

    Queensland alone has more than 15,000 abandoned mines, including 300 classified as mega, large or medium size.

    A report on these mines by the environmental group Lock the Gate Alliance is recommending the introduction of an independent authority to rehabilitate the sites.

    It proposes funding the remediation with a “modest industry levy” or from the interest on a new cash bond deposit system.

    The report said the extra money could help fund a comprehensive mine rehabilitation program in areas where the resources boom has ended.

    “There’s several thousand jobs that can be created in rural and regional Queensland, particularly in mining precincts that are badly needed now after the downturn,” Lock the Gate’s Rick Humphries said.

    “So it will be an employment generator and an economic activity generator.”

    But Queensland Mines Minister Anthony Lynham said many old mines still contain valuable resources waiting to be exploited.

    “There are a lot of resources left in old tailing dams, old tailing deposits. I’d love to see resource companies come to us with innovative ideas of how they can access those deposits,” Dr Lynham said.

    “Rehabilitation can extinguish a resource.”

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-10-23/rehabilitating-abandoned-mines-could-fill-mining-boom-job-void/7949778

    Read the whole story. The government seemingly couldn’t give a rat’s ass about the environmental damage being caused by these old mines. Despite mines being abandoned for decades, Lynham doesn’t want them rehabilitated because there might still be some blood to squeeze from the stone. Madness!

  27. Trish Corry

    Maybe you should read the article you insist others should read Kaye. Minister Lynham does not appear uncooperative or resistant at all; but offered a range of options for the abandoned mine sites. It’s laughable that you have painted Dr. Lynham as the environmental anti-Christ. The guy is a freaking saint. Has the skills to fix broken faces of little kids.

    A few problems here Kaye. Having lived next to an abandoned mine for years and people talking about reviving it for over 20 years; besides the odd person coming along every now and then and saying “It may be possible” and everyone getting excited, nothing has happened so far.

    The majority of mines are on private Land, not Govt land. This poses a lot of issues.

    The Greens / Environmental supporters are against tax payer money being funded for anything to do with mining. So that would be an uphill battle wouldn’t it? Not to mention the protests and legal battles that any investor would have to face to restart them.

    Restarting abandoned mines – worldwide, there have been lots of thought bubbles and very little action since the mid 2000’s.

    Most abandoned mines are managed and are often under consideration for other projects – like tourism etc., and as Dr. Lynham suggested turned into renewable energy sites. However, the investment is needed.

    Are are taxpayers now excited for socialism of jobs. That is Govt purchase the abandoned mines and invest billions to extract the bits that are left? Is there something I have missed?

    You mean if this happened, there wouldn’t be screams of “the money should be spent on the reef instead” crowd?

    I guess it is those thought bubbles that will put food on the table, until some investor with loads of cash and innovative viable technology may and I say may revive the odd mine or two, giving a handful of people some work. Or after years of extensive approvals, it may turn into something else. I guess, as you insist. The jobs can wait another 20 years.

    I will remember to maintain my enthusiasm for the restarting of the mine next door although that door has been slammed umpteen times. Hopefully this new guy who is still poking around might be the one. I haven’t lost hope.

    But I guess after 40 years of living here, I should have realised google had all the answers. I don’t know why no one else thought of that!

    Excuse my sarcasm Kaye, but do you not think if there were viable, easy solutions, not just the state Govt, but local investors, local councils etc., would be doing everything they could to reduce double figure unemployment!

    You forgot to mention that QLD Labor set aside over 40 million dollars to clean up and reinvigorate abandoned mines like the ones in the story and changed legislation to make those responsible to act responsibly or face the courts. Your Lock the Gate guy who you are hero worshipping isn’t happy with this either. All this while the investor I was talking about is trying to undertake a feasibility study to actually restart it and create jobs. You mate is like all Greens. My way or the highway. Never mind the Bollocks. Oops I meant jobs.

    Bad Labor. Bad! Labor Madness!

  28. Kaye Lee

    Firstly, I did not insist on anything Trish. I am purely passing on information that people can choose to read or not. I am not painting anyone as an Antichrist and I fail to see what Dr Lynham’s previous profession has to do with mine rehabilitation.

    I find your antagonism and sarcasm very counterproductive Trish. I am suggesting that coal will NOT provide jobs for the future and they certainly aren’t providing jobs now either – they are slashing them as we all know. Technology is making mines not need people. Even the trucks are remote controlled. The Abbott Point port expansion will provide ONE ongoing job according to the government’s own report.

    I don’t hero worship anyone Trish. It is you that hero worships all things Labor, refusing to face the reality that coal mining will not provide for the future and is, in fact, putting in danger Queensland’s very lucrative reef tourism industry. Your uncritical acceptance of everything Labor does is not helpful and stifles ideas.

    BTW, if you don’t use google you should. It’s a very good way to inform yourself.

  29. Trish Corry

    Regional QLDers go to bed happy tonight folks
    Kaye and Google will see everyone in a job in the new morn!

    As I said. Never mind the Bollocks. Keep on keeping on being productive Kaye. That’s the spirit.

  30. Jennifer Meyer-Smith

    How come Trish gets a free reign to disparage people personally?

  31. Kaye Lee

    The Abbott Point Project is expected to result in peak construction employment numbers of up to 164 FTEs (for one year). After the construction phase, operating employment impacts would manifest for approximately five years in the order of two FTEs. It is envisaged that these might not be in the form of new ‘jobs’, but rather a continued stream of employment opportunity for heavy and civil construction workers and their supply chains that rely on project based work.

    Construction of the Mine and Rail Project is(was) scheduled to commence in 2013/2014. It is expected that the Project (Mine and Rail) will reach peak workforce in 2015 with approximately 3,700 workers and an overlap between construction workforce and operations workforce. The workforce drops significantly from 2015 – 2018 as the scale of construction activities reduces, particularly the rail construction. It is expected that almost all workers will be recruited on a FIFO basis,

    These figures are from Adani and the Qld government’s own reports. Even if they could find someone to back it, is it worth it even if it did go ahead?

  32. Trish Corry

    Oh I was going to say before – “Should I wait for JMS to come along and give Kaye some cherry cheers and a cookie” but I wasn’t sure if I had time to wait.

    Just admit neither of you care about Jobs in regional Queensland and frankly, your harping on about keeping no jobs happening is disgusting.

    I’m off to work. I’m one of the fortunate ones.

  33. Harquebus

    Trish
    Creating new jobs is just one of the processes that are killing us.

    “There is no point in saving the planet if we ruin the economy doing it.” — former NSW Premier Morris Iemma

  34. Jennifer Meyer-Smith

    Yes Trish,

    whatever you say. You won’t shut people up by your bully language, I hope you know.

    Good on the activists who have worked hard and successfully to block the Adani mine. Employment prospects for our fellow Aussie workers and unemployed people are better served by alternative industries to filthy coal mining.

    Put your energy into advocating that, instead of causing further division amongst the community.

  35. Kaye Lee

    The court heard Adani’s experts had predicted there would be 4000 jobs during the operational phase of the mine and a $4 billion boost to the local economy, but in fact the number was closer to 400 jobs.

    A report by ACIL Consulting’s Jerome Fahrer, which confirmed the lower jobs figure, was not put before the Native Title Tribunal, the court heard.

    http://www.afr.com/news/politics/adani-distorted-jobs-from-carmichael-mine-20151122-gl5bhq#ixzz4O2pitHbo

    The Adani group has scaled down its Australian coal mine development project to $4 billion from $16 billion. The group has also marked down the production target from 60 million tonnes per annum (mtpa), announced in August 2010, to 25 mtpa.

    http://www.business-standard.com/article/companies/adani-slashes-oz-project-size-to-4-bn-116092300012_1.html

    Will that affect those 400 jobs?

  36. Michael Taylor

    Just my opinion, (and this is happening in America), the biggest growth areas and ones that also have the largest jobs growth . . . are in renewable energy, not mining. All we need is a government that gets its head around it.

  37. Kaye Lee

    Adani are also in trouble in India for dodgy invoicing. They ship coal straight from Indonesia to India but invoices go through tax havens like Singapore where the prices are greatly inflated.

    In March this year, the DRI issued a general alert to its field formations across India, outlining the modus operandi of over-invoicing of coal imports from Indonesia. The DRI alleged that money was being “siphoned” outside the country and the electricity generating firms were availing “higher tariff compensation based on artificially inflated cost of the imported coal”.

    The DRI alleged that Indonesian coal was directly imported from ports there to India while import invoices were routed through one or more intermediaries based in Singapore, Hong Kong, Dubai and British Virgin Islands to artificially inflate its value.

    http://indianexpress.com/article/business/companies/dri-notices-to-adag-essar-adani-for-alleged-violation-of-norms-3028071/

  38. Harquebus

    In regards to renewable energy, what we need is politicians that realize that there is no such thing. The EROEI of “renewables” too low and is why it is deliberately never factored. They are energy sinks and will never be an energy source.

  39. Andreas Bimba

    Capital intensive resource projects create jobs during the construction phase but produce a substantial negative number of jobs nationally during the production phase. Why because the substantial exports raise the relative value of our dollar making other exporters less competitive, imports cheaper and economic sectors like local tourism and education for foreigners less attractive.

    Many resource projects even provide estimates for the net national job losses expected in their economic impact reports.

    The squeezing out of our automotive manufacturing industry with up to 200,000 job losses is in large part to the high dollar and our huge LNG, coal, iron ore and other resource exports that will ultimately directly employ very few.

    Time for a new Brisbane line that crosses Australia to Perth and sell the red neck half to China? Or we could vote in competent governments.

  40. Stephen Brailey

    Trish this whole jobs and mining thing is at best a well flogged horse! A job doesn’t mean anything if you can’t breath the air and as noted before you can’t actually eat money! Have some empathy for rural QLD and the youth give me a break! Next you’re going to call people un-Australian for not backing coal mining! Decentralised power generation using renewables should be based at hundreds of sites scattered throughout regional Australia providing 1000’s of ongoing jobs and associated improvements to existing infrastructure. Rather than billions spent on what will be stranded assets to support an unsustainable industry that will produce more CO2 emissions than several modern countries.

  41. Anomander

    There are far more jobs to be had in the renewables sector than there are in mining.

    Queensland is literally bathed in massive quantities of solar radiation, and establishing solar farms instead of digging bloody great, toxic holes in the ground.

    I can understand the impassioned plea for jobs, but there’s little point having short-term jobs when the by-product of the activity destroys huge swathes of arable land, displaces and kills hundreds of threatened species, affects and pollutes the water table and atmosphere and ultimately drive the climate on a downward spiral – plus the fact the multi-billion dollar cost for the cleanup will undoubtedly fall on the public, because there’s no profit for the miners in cleaning-up the mess the created.

    If the Queensland government is serious about jobs, they should be pursuing renewables and not flogging the dead horse that is coal.

  42. Kaye Lee

    I still like the idea of high speed rail, one that Albanese supports, to revitalise regional Australia allowing people to move out of urban areas but commute easily. It would free up the current road, rail and airways which would help business and would allow for decentralisation. It would also help with pressure on housing. I think it has far greater potential than coal mining.

  43. Adrianne Haddow

    You could look to the Hunter Valley for the evidence of mining jobs and the great employment opportunities they didn’t bring.
    The work force of these mines has been reduced drastically and is continuing its reduction. That, however, hasn’t stopped the mines from applying to expand their operations.
    When the mining boom was in full swing, the miners were FIFO bringing huge social problems for local communities, apart from the negative gearing crowd who were making a tidy profit from rental properties.

    The take over by Chinese mining Shenhua of the Liverpool Plains, at present a hugely productive food bowl, has been fought against by Lock the Gate (Bless them!) and local farmers who have been farming that land for generations. But to no avail, thanks to the NSW approval board.
    The expansions of some mines to within a kilometre of some townships hasn’t had an impact on local unemployment. Bulga township has been fighting for years to preserve their town but to no avail. Again approval for this expansion got the green light.
    The expansion of the Drayton mine threatens to impact the billion dollar horse stud industry, and owners are fearing they will need to relocate.
    The vineyards of the Hunter are also at risk from the environmental impacts of these mines.

    Driving into the Hunter Valley from the New England tablelands means driving into a pall of dust stretching for hundreds of kilometres. Children, and their parents, in the area are suffering from a spike in the occurrence of respiratory diseases, a factor which isn’t included in the economic examination of a mine’s viability and the benefits those operations supposedly bring. Uncovered coal trains spread this dust pall right into Newcastle where the port is located.
    The storage for the mountains of coal extracted and awaiting shipment, in mostly Chinese ships, is across the river from the city and when the wind is right, the city suffers.

    The influence of the mining companies, and their donations, to both Lib and Labor parties, does not seem to result in any benefit for the Australian people or for the many successful local industries forced out of the area because of the environmental impact of these operations.

  44. Andreas Bimba

    We are all desperately concerned with adequately paid, meaningful work for all. The answer really is the economic approach of the Modern Monetary Theory economists and to reduce our environmental footprint especially greenhouse gas emissions.

    I have no doubt this strategy will work. Stop letting the Kleptocracy determine all of our political options. We must educate ourselves about MMT and educate others as currently very few are aware of this perfectly feasible solution.

  45. Jennifer Meyer-Smith

    Well said Andreas

  46. Kaye Lee

    Imagine being able to live the Goulburn lifestyle but commute to Sydney in less than 45 minutes, or do the same from Shepparton to Melbourne, or from Grafton to Brisbane. You could build a house on land acquired for $1000 a block, with developers using the increased value of the land to fund some of the $120 billion-plus cost of a high-speed rail project.

    Central Japan Railway, which operates Japan’s bullet train, claims it can build the Melbourne to Sydney line in eight years. China’s Centurion Group has told a parliamentary committee it can build the service at no cost to government provided it can profit from the increased land value.

    We could upgrade Whyalla and insist they use Australian steel. Politicians could get trains to Canberra rather than chartering private jets.

    Seems like a good plan to me.

  47. Andreas Bimba

    Lots of good comments except from the ‘old gun’. High speed rail is definitely a good option down the Eastern seaboard and probably across to Adelaide at some point. These projects are viable and best paid for through federal fiscal stimulus funding. Regional rail can also be improved a lot.

    Good quality affordable high density housing as close as possible to places of employment and connected with good public transport as well as bicycle paths and walking paths will suit most however.

  48. guest

    This idea that the Adani mine is the answer to Qld’s employment problems is not shown by the well-known facts already in the public domain. The Adani mine is a pipedream. Surely I do not have to go though the details.

    the total mine is 5x the area of Sydney Harbour
    there will be fewer jobs than Adani claims
    financing is not secure
    the life of the mine is not clear, especially since India is reducing the use of coal
    a 4.5 hour drive to the coast means such a railway will drop too much coal dust
    at the coast coal dust will drift into the sea near the GBR
    some talk about carbon capture in Oz, but not in India where the coal is to be burnt into CO2 emissions
    the investment to establish the mine and its ultimate closure will break hearts and leave the coal as stranded assets
    since many unemployed will not get to work in the mine, what is planned for them?

    I am concerned about the idea of “food before environment”. It is not a matter of either/or.

    I am concerned about “jobs and growth” where I see jobs and destruction.

    I am concerned about “transitioning the economy”, especially at a snail’s pace favouring redundant vested interests.

    I am concerned about a Labor party which allows workers and the unemployed/partly employed to be dumped and bullied and legislated against as if their labor/existence is of no value

    So we see migration world-wide – and the unemployed, the disenfranchised and the disillusioned are downtrodden and seek hope in hopeless places/dreams/snake-oil merchants.

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