48 comments

1. etnorbJune 10, 2016 at 9:55 pm

   Sadly Barnacle Joyce is just another inept, lying “shining example” of our illustrious so-called Liberal party! It appears NONE of them could lay straight in bed! Couple this with their flat earth, right wing, conservative, tea party philosophy & it does not bode well for the rest of the population. Jobson Growth etc is just a useless 3-word saying, which amounts to absolutely nil in my books! In fact, the more I read & hear about this useless mob of obscenely over-paid so-called “politicians” the more afraid of our future I become! And to think this idiot is our “deputy” PM? Deputy dawg more like it! Wise words Candy!

2. kathysutherland2013June 10, 2016 at 10:12 pm

   Except that he’s the leader of the Nationals. Still, same diff, I suppose.

3. Jack RussellJune 10, 2016 at 11:06 pm

   Because of this, and all the other betrayals since 2013, how many traditional Liberal/National voters are NOT going to vote LNP on July 2?

4. suemaynesJune 10, 2016 at 11:38 pm

   Joyce is being deceptive from 2 perspectives.

   1. the Cth can make laws to take some ‘thing’ into the aegis of the Cth. That action remove the States law-making power in that area, I would say s(i) (xx) and (xxxiv) would fit the bill.

   2. the Cth chooses to leave it in the States hands so the States can cop all the flak.

   But those 2 points are not the real lie – they are just deceptions. The big, huge lie is that not one single party running for office in this upcoming election – whether national, libs, labor, greens, etc – operate within the rules of the Cth Constitution anyway.

   Instead they operate under administrative law – which is bound to UN Admiralty. So it is NOT about the harm done to our water, the harm done to our way of life, the harm done to our food supplies – it is simply business.

   When every person who assumes they own property in this country, registered that ownership – they gave the rights of control of that property to the government. All the government are doing is operating in business and there is WAY more money to be made from the mining companies use of the property, than from us.

   Forget which party is the worst – they ALL operate the same way when it comes to administrative control. Never heard of admin law? America has suffered from it since the 1930’s and their Supreme Court has warned, “Because of what appear to be Lawful commands [Statutory Rules, Regulations and Restrictions] on the surface, many citizens, because of their respect for what appears to be law, are cunningly coerced into waiving their rights, due to ignorance… [deceptive practices, constructive fraud, barratry, legal plunder, conversion, and malicious prosecution in inferior administrative State courts].” (United States v. Minker, 350 U.S. 179, 187, 76 S.Ct. 281, 100 L.Ed. 185 (1956)

   Here are a couple of quotes – very relevant to Australia because our govt copied theirs: From the chapter “Lawmaking by Administrative Agencies” in The Dirty Dozen, How Twelve Supreme Court Cases Radically Expanded Government and Eroded Freedom, by Robert A. Levy and William Mellor [Cato Institute, 2009, pp.67-85].
   “You probably assume — maybe because the Constitution says so — that Congress enacts all federal laws. Guess again. Our federal administrative agencies actually dwarf Congress when it comes to implementing regulations that control what Americans can and cannot do. In effect, Congress had delegated much of its lawmaking authority to unelected bureaucrats. They, in turn, make thousands of law prescribing rules of conduct that bind private citizens, state governments, and local governments”

   “Administrative law is commonly defended as a new sort of power, a product of the 19th and the 20th centuries that developed to deal with the problems of modern society in all its complexity. From this perspective, the Framers of the Constitution could not have anticipated it and the Constitution would not have barred it. What I will suggest, in contrast, is that administrative power is actually very old. It revives what used to be called prerogative or absolute power, and it is thus something that the Constitution centrally prohibited.”
   Philip Hamburger, “The History and Danger of Administrative Law,” A Publication of Hilldale College, Impris, September 2014, Volume 23, Number 9, p.1

   At least it is starting to go pear-shaped in America – http://www.forbes.com/sites/danielfisher/2015/06/09/did-a-judge-just-kick-off-the-great-unraveling-of-the-administrative-state-with-sec-ruling/#6887975523a1

   Neither Liberals OR Labor have told us about this system of “governance” – which is described in a document in the Senate files (Can Responsible Government Survive in Australia by David Hamer) as – Elective Dictatorship. Great title – you get to elect your dictator, then protest when it takes total control.

   So the whole uproar about mining is also a very good way to divert us from the real facts of the political fraud we face in this country.

5. vixstarJune 11, 2016 at 1:21 am

   Water is vital for Australia to survive all animal and plants are dependent on it,.you start tampering with it we will loose it forever and Australia will die, this land , her first peoples looked after her for generations and generations along come capitalists like this stupid Liberal government and misguided cockheads like Barnyard and it’s lost to future generations by their own ignorance of science.wake up Australia vote for someone who will look after Australia her land and her native wildlife, fauna.

6. babyjewels10June 11, 2016 at 8:09 am

   I think Barnaby’s performance on Q&A did a big favour to Labor. He simply isn’t interested in the problems of his own constituency. I hope those regional voters think, this election, before they vote, because they traditionally don’t.

7. diannaartJune 11, 2016 at 8:22 am

   You’ve been taught to believe that a vote outside the big two is a vote wasted. That’s manipulation.

   Very true. Labor as much as Liberal have campaigned against voting for minor parties or independents. Neither party is about collaboration with others – unless forced to.

8. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 10:09 am

   Well said Candy. I am advocating for people, who live in the Batman electorate in Victoria, that they vote #1 Russell Hayward of the Australian Progressives in the House of Representatives. For every Victorian, I would also advocate that amongst their 5 Greens Senate candidates including Di Natale and Janet Rice et al; and Ricky Muir and Mark Dickenson as Victorian Independents, they could also choose the two Australian Progressives candidates for the Senate, who are David Knight and Josh Gilmore.

   Also, I think suemaynes has done us all a good service with her enlightening comment because I agree decisions made under Administrative Law jurisdiction are the every day causes of our daily grind that restricts our quality of life. I want an overhaul of our judiciary and executive powers so that ordinary citizens are not controlled by a perpetual metaphorical whip above their heads for intimidation. I also want lower and many medium order spent convictions to be wiped off people’s records immediately so that they don’t impact on people’s opportunities in all facets of life.

   NOW that voters are listening more and more to alternative voices for Parliament, there is greater impetus for the dinosaurs to be worried that their power bases are only on sand afterall.

   With that in mind, I have tirelessly been advocating that the best way to get the LNP Degenerates out of power on 2 July 2016 is for the ALLiance of the Greens/Progressive Parties/sane Independents/left and centre left Labor to be seen to be forming a working ALLiance to win government and with the view to sustain that working ALLiance that will work for a robust Progressive, Reformist, Egalitarian Australia in the 21st century.

9. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 1:51 pm

   [takes deep, long breath]

   Trigger warning: may contain excessive amounts of candour.

   Jennifer.

   NOW that voters are listening more and more to alternative voices for Parliament, there is greater impetus for the dinosaurs to be worried that their power bases are only on sand afterall.

   Yeah, ain’t it swell. Actually, no it’s not that swell at all. In fact it’s downright scary if you stop to think about more deeply than if you’re engaged in a Grade 7 Social Studies project.

   You asked me last night in another thread about what I’d like to see rather than just speaking to the problems I perceive. I’ve lost track of that thread for now (gotta bookmark that stuff), but I’ll give you a more fulsome explanation of why this advocacy for indies and micros strikes me as a teeny bit batshit.

   Let’s approach this from a place of reality, not fantasy, shall we?

   Ricky Muir – the birth-child and initial puppet of electoral consultant Glenn Druery of Minor Party Alliance fame, whose antics also graciously gave us Bob freakin’ Day . Hooray for democracy and micro party preference dealing! Hooray!!

   Oh, hang on, maybe it’s not all that rosy after-all, given that such dealings might give us a Senator in NSW from the bloody Health Australia Party, who present themselves as a centrist party with all the right rhetoric in place but who are, in fact, a bunch of ratbag anti-vaccination, alternative medicine loons.

   https://www.healthaustraliaparty.com.au/ Don’t they sound lovely? You’d vote for them, right?

   And guess what, they just got first spot on the NSW senate ballot. So, yeah, let’s push the idea of giving indies and micros and other small parties a go. What possible trouble can that get us into?

   Hang on, David Leyonhjelm is on the phone .. I think I can hear a gun cocking ….. or a cock gunning …one of the two ….

   But in pushing the indie/micro mantra let’s not forget not all indies and micros and those fatuous single-issue parties – the scourge that they are – can be labeled progressive. Most can’t, and it’s not only progressive voters who are hearing this indies/minor parties mantra. This stuff works both ways.

   Back to Ricky Muir – he may have evolved into something less absurd than what we expected when we first met him, but so what? I mean, so what? He still came from the ridiculous Motoring Enthusiasts Party. Go and look at their website and their “core values” page and tell me they are not a pack of libertarian yahoos.

   Glen Lazurus? He’s about as progressive as my anal sphincter. It’s irrelevant that these small time Senators have voted against this Government on occasion. Utterly irrelevant. Broken clocks…twice a day etc etc. I mean, they had to cut and paste their constitution from Xenophon’s party.

   At least the Australian progressives managed to write their own. Hang on ..Tim Jones is on the phone ….gotta get a silent number. What’s that Tim? You started the APs and they shitcanned you? They’re not as progressive as they make out? C’mon mate, you’re just still upset that Chris Kenny made you look like a dick on TV. Anyway, sorry, where was I ….

   Cathy McGowan, Rob Oakeshott, Tony Windsor – all conservatives. We only love them because they did damage to the LNP. Oakeshott has political principles, certainly, but they are not progressive principles. He would have supported a Turnbull government if Gillard had been rolled in the first spill (and Turnbull gained LNP leadership). For God’s sake let’s not romanticise these people. Both Windsor and Oakeshott will almost certainly support a Turnbull government in a hung parliament come July 2.

   While recognising the democratic right of single-issue parties or micros or indies or the extraordinarily ironically named Australian Independents Party to make their play for power, I wish they wouldn’t. Well, at least not the ones who don’t make any effort to develop a policy base that attempts to reflect the complexity of a modern pluralist society. They get in the way, pure and simple.

   Promoting alternatives to the so-called “duopoly” is a hell of a gamble. Especially if people don’t do their homework on who these people really are. I can’t stress enough the importance of that point – do your homework, don’t just get all emotionally caught up in the amour of anti “big two” rhetoric. The safest and most politically reasonable thing to do, for me, if you’re wanting to send a message to Labor and the Coalition is to preference the Greens as much as possible – before anyone else!

   Returning to where I started with Jennifer’s now full-blown obsession with alliances that can’t happen – as I’ve said before, such a thing isn’t necessary. The Greens and any progressives that manage a seat in the HOR will make an agreement with Labor to form a minority government. Any progressives in the Senate will vote with Labor on progressive issues and give them a hard time when they’re being otherwise – and that’s fine with me; it’s how it should be.

   I’ve also previously noted, without so much as a hint of acknowledgement from the Alliance Apparitionists, that any movement on the part of the Labor Party to announce a formal Alliance with the Greens, let alone someone like the HEMP or Socialist Equality parties would be utterly fatal. You could immediately kiss the election goodbye because Labor’s centrist vote would collapse. Seats like Petrie and Longman here in Qld, which Labor has every chance of regaining/winning, would be history. This is not Labor’s fault, it’s simply the reality of the electorate.

   Please keep in mind that dynamics created by the Minor Parties Alliance and Alliance for Progress mean that all these parties and now lumped together. If you think it’s possible for Labor, or even the Greens for that matter, to form a formal Alliance with these groups you might want to rethink your perception of the reality of the Australian electorate.

   Labor can do what it likes from government in relation to forging closer ties with such groups. It can’t do it from Opposition at this time, and neither can the Greens.

   Vote for people or parties whose philosophy and policy framework you know about, and not because of bullshit labels like “Independent” or “Micro/Minor”, or “Progressive”. Labels are crap.

10. diannaartJune 11, 2016 at 2:25 pm

    ByB

    Vote for people or parties whose philosophy and policy framework you know about, and not because of bullshit labels like “Independent” or “Micro/Minor”, or “Progressive”. Labels are crap.

    I have been following Jennifer’s comments here for a long time now, and if I have learnt anything it is that she is thoughtful, considered and reasonable, not at all the type of person to be taken in by mere “labels”.

    Perhaps, ByB, you could spend more time in reflection than in judging/labelling others, or if the full gaze into the mirror is too painful, at least read and comprehend the comments of other posters before inserting both feet in whatever orifice they fit.

11. AthenaJune 11, 2016 at 2:59 pm

    “Because of this, and all the other betrayals since 2013, how many traditional Liberal/National voters are NOT going to vote LNP on July 2?”

    How many people are going to keep voting the same way, expecting a different outcome?

12. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 3:10 pm

    diannaart,

    I have been following Jennifer’s comments here for a long time now, and if I have learnt anything it is that she is thoughtful, considered and reasonable, not at all the type of person to be taken in by mere “labels”.

    That’s probably quite true. I was speaking in terms far broader than Jennifer in that closing statement. I perhaps should have made that clearer. The rest of what you said isn’t worth addressing.

13. jantoniusJune 11, 2016 at 3:17 pm

    No diannaart,
    That is an unfair response to a thoughtful and helpful post by Backyard B.
    He has raised info for discussion, on the appalling reflection on general electorate awareness provided by so-called ‘independents’.

    There might be the odd non-aligned candidate who is reliably reasonable and informed, but voting on a hunch can be support for a malignant obsessive or a dangerously wavering dill. Such is the culture.

    Any possible alliance involving such major brains could be a pest to progressive politics, even if chaotic and temporary. The Libs would be the beneficiaries. Queering fair possibility is their business.

14. AthenaJune 11, 2016 at 3:26 pm

    I have to agree with a lot of what BYB writes above. Some minor parties can be quite dangerous with their very limited focus. We saw an example several weeks ago in NSW when the Christian Democrats and Shooters & Fishers voted with the Liberal Party to stop the protesting about mining. The Shooters got gun silencers out of that deal, proving that they are willing to see the food bowls of the nation ruined by mining, so that a relatively small number of people can own silencers and put other people’s lives at risk with them. I still haven’t found out what Nile’s mob of wowsers got out of it.

    I’ve been voting for minor parties for some years now, but I vote for those with a range of policies across a broad spectrum of issues. I find out well before election day who my candidates are and I research them. There are a number of them that seem good on the surface, but when you do a little digging they are not the sort of people we need in government, e.g. the anti-vaccination party.

    That said, it is absolute stupidity to keep on voting for the major parties and expect a different outcome. Clearly both are pandering to big business. To vote for the best of the worst only endorses their actions. Voters need to start voting for what they actually want and I agree with Candy that it takes courage to do that. The major parties are trying very hard to keep the minors out. If we let them, we’ll end up like the US where two options is all we will ever have – bad and worse – and it will be impossible to change direction.

15. diannaartJune 11, 2016 at 5:06 pm

    No ByB

    You did not make yourself clear – your comment was addressed to Jennifer following immediately after her discussion of alliances between progressives.

    Hey, never let an opportunity to spread the negativity, go by, BYB.

16. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 5:11 pm

    Hey, never let an opportunity to spread the negativity, go by, BYB.

    I’m just gunna roll my eyes at that and move on.

17. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 5:18 pm

    Thanks diannaart,

    you get that I’m not advocating just any micro parties or Independents. Shame that ByB and subsequent commenters have failed to see that I also say we must be discerning in who we choose and that means doing our homework first before we commit ourselves to supporting any candidates outside the ho-hum dinosaur duopoly.

    Since the LNP would never be a consideration in my eyes, that leaves Labor; the Greens; various left and centre left and centre micro parties; and reasonable, grassroots Independents. So, that does not mean Bob Day as ByB stated or the Christian Democrats or Shooters & Fishers Party cited by Athena.

    For me, it definitely means the Greens 1st, probably Labor 2nd if only for expediency in the House of Reps and Greens 1st in the Senate with an assortment of Progressive Parties from the Alliance For Progress group namely the Australian Progressives and the Pirate Party, and worthy Independents such as Ricky Muir and Mark Dickenson from Victoria.

    If ByB wants some help with selections for Queensland, I’ll be only too happy to help. By the way, I’m well aware ByB thinks he has some insider knowledge about Tim Jones. Perhaps ByB would like to enlighten us on what that might be?

18. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 5:36 pm

    JMS,

    If ByB wants some help with selections for Queensland, I’ll be only too happy to help.

    That would be great given the scant nature of my knowledge of politics. Much appreciated. Can you make it a priority? My need is pretty desperate.

19. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 5:44 pm

    Only too happy to help, ByB. I’ll keep you posted. Perhaps you’d also like to address the rest of my final paragraph.

20. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 6:03 pm

    Nope.

21. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 6:05 pm

    Why am I not surprised?

    [Backs out gracefully…]

22. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 6:27 pm

    There’s no obligation on my part to respond to your own inferences and subsequent insinuations. It’s a matter of public record that the Australian Progressives turfed their progenitor and that he claims they are not as progressive as they’d like us to think they are. No “insider” knowledge necessary, unless you want to characterise the WWW and Twitter as “inside”.

    APs actions regarding Jones may well have been kosher (the process seems to have been). You’d know more about that than me. The documents regarding it are not altogether informative about the details.

    I wish you were more open to speaking to my point about the potential collapse of Labor’s centrist vote as a likely result of your Alliance notions, but I guess that’s not going to happen.

23. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 6:42 pm

    Well ByB,

    you finally ask, in an acceptable manner, what my criticisms of Labor are and why I support the Alliance as a Viable alternative to extreme Neoliberalism from the LNP Degenetates and moderate Neoliberalism from Labor, as the quasi alternative party in the dinosaur duopoly.

    Simple. I don’t want Labor to be centrist. I’ll repeat. I don’t want Labor to be centrist.

    Centrist is playing to the Neoliberalist agenda. Over 4 decades Labor leaders have been squeemishly pulling Labor Right and da-dah! now they’re there. We don’t want a LNP Degenerate Lite coz anybody with any self-respect would think that stinks.

    We need a true, ALTernative Government. Unfortunately, current Labor does NOT live up to that requisite so I advocate The Alliance instead which means the Greens, Progressive Micro Parties, reasonable (and sane) Independents like Muir and Dickenson in Vic and oh yes Labor, if they behave.

24. nurses1968June 11, 2016 at 6:55 pm

    Well I laughed and laughed and laughed
    Backyard Bob I thought you too wise to get caught up in this delusional Alliance rubbish that exists in the head of only one for there is no organisation no group no committee no decision makers no nothing and as for ” probably Labor 2nd if only for expediency” wasn’t the “Alliance whisperer’ told that Labor were never going to play a part in this silly mind game

25. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 7:13 pm

    nurses1968,

    great friends with cornlegend, Hip, hip, hooray!

    Also safely employed, remunerated and expectant of extra benefits,

    Why has it taken you so long to respond?

    Don’t bother. Your neoliberal denial of what is going on in the so-called alternative government is deplorable.

    Don’t ever question me why I want an alternative to this Neoliberalist system represented by the LNP Degenerates and your mates/girls in Labor!!!

    Where is cornlegend, by the way?

26. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 7:27 pm

    JMS,

    Simple. I don’t want Labor to be centrist. I’ll repeat. I don’t want Labor to be centrist.

    This suffers from a reality-desire disconnect. Repeat, this suffers from a reality-desire disconnect. Your desires are ultimately perfectly reasonable as you’ve expressed them, and I share them, but the electorate is not currently open to it. Your ideas would guarantee an LNP victory. Guarantee it.

    It matters not one jot that you or I or anybody else would prefer Labor to not be centrist. What matters is that a very meaningful proportion of their voter base is. That fact cannot be ignored in some grandiose haze of loquacious lefty longing. At some point a reality that may disappoint us has to be factored into our thinking. The truth of the nature of the electorate has to be taken into account.

    There is a current movement in Australian politics (and in the Labor Party), a movement towards the progressive left, but it requires evolutionary nurturing, not revolutionary rhetoric that will simply freak the electorate out and thereby ruin its own momentum. Parties and political paradigms that allow ambition and promise to cloud judgement and reason almost always fail.

    Anyway, I’m not sure why I’m debating this with someone who keeps referring to Ricky Muir as an independent. I mean, really.

27. nurses1968June 11, 2016 at 7:33 pm

    I;ll buy and send you a dream catcher if you like
    “Why has it taken you so long to respond?”
    I work long and varying shifts
    “Where is cornlegend, by the way?”
    Queensland

    Jennifer just fess up there is no Alliance other than in your head right?

28. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 7:55 pm

    Jennifer just fess up there is no Alliance other than in your head right?

    Well, Jennifer’s Alliance is obviously in her head, but a party alliance, of sorts exists: http://allianceforprogress.org.au/

    With some interesting aspects:

    Preferencing agreements are to be negotiated in good faith; and

    If an Alliance member decides to preference any non-member ahead of another Alliance member, they must notify that Alliance member of this in a timely manner.

29. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 8:06 pm

    ByB and your Labor ghouls.

    if you can’t win fairly then why stop at unfairly?

    You know what I’ve always HATED???

    Ganging up bully behaviour that drowns out alternative voices!!!

    Tonight, ByB you have finally proven how prepared you are to accept a neoliberalist regime that will just keep the powerful in power at the expense of all the rest of us.

    Very sad.

    See allianceforprogress.org.au/ which needs the wonderful Greens and the [snort] Labor lot (despite their neoliberal tendancies) to form a FORMidable ALLiance to win for them and win for us and win for AUS

30. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 8:18 pm

    Cosmic sigh.

31. nurses1968June 11, 2016 at 8:33 pm

    OMG how many times do you have to be told the ” [snort] Labor ” do not want you
    Is there anyone else other than you in the JMS Alliance please be truthful

32. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 8:45 pm

    Nobody else but The ALLiance sorry little degenerates

33. nurses1968June 11, 2016 at 9:16 pm

    So let me get this straight finally after much effort “Nobody else”
    The Alliance consists of you and you alone with no contibution from ANY political Party Independent Micro Party Progressive Micro Parties or any other?
    You are the sole arbiter on who is in or out left or right worthy or unworthy and all without even discussion with any party and you with the sole and exclusive right to banish anyone you deem unworthy? Why does Supreme Leader Kim Jong Un spring so readily to mind and you question others political beliefs?
    How dare you

34. jantoniusJune 11, 2016 at 9:17 pm

    That Barnaby Joyce…
    One hell of a wacko, or what?

35. Backyard BobJune 11, 2016 at 9:26 pm

    He’s deeply misunderstood, especially by himself.

36. jantoniusJune 11, 2016 at 9:35 pm

    Somehow he doesn’t seem so odd tonight.

37. jantoniusJune 11, 2016 at 9:40 pm

    One from the series of Famous Last Words;
    “F*ck it, I will have one of those drinks!’

38. AthenaJune 11, 2016 at 9:53 pm

    “OMG how many times do you have to be told the ” [snort] Labor ” do not want you”

    So true. That’s because the present day Liberal Lite…er….ALP makes Malcolm Fraser’s government look progressive. When a large number of voters are jumping back and forth between the major parties at every election, they really cannot tell the difference between them.

39. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 11:43 pm

    What a pack of wackers you lot are!

    So somebody doesn’t agree with your brand of neoliberal politics and suddenly they are flipflop neoliberals like you!

    Nah sorry, that is not how you weaklinks can frame it.

    ByB, jantonius and Athena, you can all have a nice warm shower and calm down. Winning back government with a legitimate mandate will take a lot more than that.

    For a start, I suggest you begin to listen to tonight’s discussion and understand there are more on the anti-LNP side than your precious –

    – Little Lib-lite Laborites –

    would have you believe.

    You need to start looking at who is genuinely anti-neoliberalism.

40. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 11, 2016 at 11:51 pm

    oops I forget nurses1968, in my last comment.

    Sorry nurses, if you’re feeling forgotten and unacknowledged for your usual stupidity.

41. AthenaJune 11, 2016 at 11:56 pm

    Ahem… my precious Little Lib-lite Laborites? I don’t think so. I haven’t voted for the ALP in years and cannot see myself doing so in the foreseeable future.

42. Backyard BobJune 12, 2016 at 12:02 am

    You’re not helping yourself, Jennifer. You really, truly aren’t.

43. corvus boreusJune 12, 2016 at 8:11 am

    Here are the ‘Alliances’ currently operating in federal politics;

    *Alliance for Progress; a preference swap bloc consisting of a handful of parties with roughly similar (‘progressive’) ideologies.
    http://allianceforprogress.org.au/members/

    *Minority Party Alliance; a large preference brokerage bloc (Druery’s horse-trading firm) consisting of a mixed swag of parties ranging from vegan animal libbers to militant hoplophiles.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minor_Party_Alliance

    *Socialist Alliance; a political party of the left wing-tip (they usually get around 0.05% of the primary vote).

    *Australian Liberty Alliance; a new political party of the far-right fringe, with a platform of religious uber-nationalism.

    Ps, Backyard Bob, if you have any valid reasons for reservations about the Australian Progressives (or specific details on the cause of Tim Jones’ departure), I would appreciate you posting an informational link.

44. Jennifer Meyer-SmithJune 12, 2016 at 10:25 am

    My apologies to Athena last night for including you in my recommendation that Alliance naysayers should have a nice warm shower. I confess I overlooked (in the heat of the moment) your sensible comment @ 9.53 pm. 🙂

    Thanks corvus for the supporting links. Obviously, I do not endorse any Right wing fringe types such as Australian Liberty Alliance.

45. diannaartJune 12, 2016 at 10:26 am

    Backyard Bob, if you have any specific details on valid reasons for reservations about the Australian Progressives (or the cause of Tim Jones’ departure), I would appreciate you posting an informational link.

    Yes, I’d like to see that.

    😉

46. AthenaJune 12, 2016 at 11:06 am

    Cheers, JMS. No worries.

47. Backyard BobJune 12, 2016 at 2:18 pm

    CB,

    Ps, Backyard Bob, if you have any valid reasons for reservations about the Australian Progressives (or specific details on the cause of Tim Jones’ departure), I would appreciate you posting an informational link.

    I have nothing myself in the way of expressible “reservations” regarding the APs, other than to say I’ve been ignored by them on occasions which is, of course, entirely typical of political parties so not very meaningful.

    I’ve asked for detail from Tim Jones but he remains coy, despite his frequent Twitter warnings about them. The documented process of Tim’s “departure” used to be there at their website but I can not find it and I seem to have not kept it in my documents on this PC. I’ll keep looking.

    It was quite interesting and I have to say it seemed to reflect quite well on APs internal processes – from the point of view of an outsider. Anyway, I’ll post a link if I can find it again.

48. Backyard BobJune 12, 2016 at 5:12 pm

    Btw, in regard to this, you could just ask Jennifer for some info since she was part of the process and her signature is at the bottom of the document(s) concerning it. I don’t occasionally throw it in her face for no reason. I actually think it is a matter of public interest that the Australian Progressives took significant punitive action against their founder and that he continues to publicly warn against supporting them.

    If I’m going to vote for them – i.e. take them seriously – I’d like to know that this action was reasonable and not something that might cause me concern regarding their nature.