Should the ABC be supporting the Nazi salute in the interest of balance?
I’m a Gemini so I’m always in two minds about everything. Of course, on the one hand, I think Astrology is bunkum but, on the other hand, I would say that because I’m a Gemini…
Anyway, I do get that when governments become the arbiters of what’s right and wrong in terms of values then we’re on a slippery slide towards a dictatorship…
On the other hand, surely that’s the reason we have governments: to legislate about what’s right and wrong in terms of values.
After all, sovereign citizens notwithstanding, governments decide that there’s a general consensus in the community that theft is wrong, so they pass laws against it and we’re all happy with that because we don’t want our property stolen… And I’m not sure that even the sovereign citizens argue that the police don’t have a right to stop someone from stealing their property…
So when it comes to the Nazi salute, we have to balance out the rights of different people. Most people in the general community find the whole Nazi ideology repugnant and feel like any outward displays of something that caused so much devastation is offensive and should be banned. On the other hand, it’s argued, we have to consider the rights of Nazis to be Nazis. Although, strangely, nobody at the ABC – in the interests of balance – has had anyone telling us about how good Nazis are…
I remember someone, when talking about a person’s sexual preference, saying they didn’t mind what they did at home, but they shouldn’t be doing it in the Main Street and scaring the horses. And I suppose a compromise could be that the Neo-Nazis could be allowed to march around their own lounge room, doing “Seig Heil” salutes before invading the kitchen. I suspect that wouldn’t make them happy because part of their joy is getting together and doing those choreographed routines which finish with them raising their arms so that they can smell each other’s armpits without getting too close to their comrades.
Is “comrade” the correct word here? I’ve read various commentators try to say that Hitler was a socialist because of the word “socialist” in the name “National Socialists”. Of course, “Democratic” is in the official name of North Korea and “Sea” is in the name of the city of Sea Lake which is midway between Bendigo and Mildura and “Liberal” is in the name of the Liberal Party. As for the Nationals, it seems an inappropriate title given they only stand in a handful of electorates. Then we have Pauline Hanson’s One Nation which seems to want to exclude most of us from the nation…
Anyway, I do think it’s pretty hard to argue that the Nazis were socialist when they were aligned with Italy’s fascist party who actually called themselves the “National Fascist Party” to save any confusion.
Of course, we can argue semantics for ages and I’m sure that some of the more right-wing commentators will still say that you can’t blame us for the Nazis because they were socialists, completely overlooking the fact that the thing that makes a government good or bad isn’t its economic ideology alone. The fact is that both capitalist and communist governments have unleashed horrors on their people. What makes a government good is the extent to which its laws and regulations protect the rights of everyday citizens to go about their daily business without harm or harassment. Sometimes a balance needs to be struck between the rights of one person over the rights of another, and sometimes this balance isn’t easy, but I think we can all agree that people don’t have the right to shit in a city street because of how it affects the people around them.
Similarly, I’d be happy with the banning of the Nazi salute. But if you have some sort of freedom argument, how do you argue against other people shitting in the street?
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Rossleigh ….. from too much hard experience in an electorate having a representative of the Nazional$ in both state & Feral Parliament, I must protest your comment, ” As for the Nationals, it seems an inappropriate title given they only stand in a handful of [Nazional$ voters]”.
The current debate about MDB water revolves around the abuse of the licensing system where about 135 registered irrigators in NW NSW have ripped off the system to the detriment of everybody downstream. There was limited, if any, policing of water taking and the monitoring of water use was frustrated by disabling recording equipment. I am advised that this historical system has been replaced recently.
How did these irrigators get away with such behaviour? Guess where many of the political donations come from.
So a sceptical political observer could reasonably conclude that the Australian COALition misgovernments have practised ”wealth socialism” for the benefit of foreign owned multinational corporations and individuals who can afford professional accountancy expertise. And why not? Such expertise is a business expense and so also a tax deduction.
In any and all discussions of rights and freedoms we need to start always including discussion of their corresponding responsibilities. Currently, anyone would think responsibilities don’t exist.
I always remember a German friend I worked with in the early 80’s telling me that when he was a child in the 1930’s Germany having lessons at school on how to do a proper Nazi salute and rote learning of the repugnant ideology. If he was alive now he would have been repulsed and sickened with the surge in neo-Nazis, supremacists and politicians who are more than than willing to play to those groups to further their own agendas
Who are they saluting with the Nazi salute? Hitler is long gone.
Florence, some people like living in the past yet learning nothing of any value from it, quite the skill set if I were to be sarcastic. Hitler is history, but his image still lives in the heads of some zombie-like fools who ironically have both a chip on their shoulder and a superiority complex, or is that superiority simplex? It’s a bit like some true believers think Dutton & the LNP are going to save other Australian from themselves. This is despite the fact that experts have identified the LNP pronouns as being ‘ delusional ‘ & ‘ self-entitled ‘. Personally, I don’t have time to waste trying to convert them. They’re lost in the wilderness, until they’re not, with some luck.
As for the Nazi salute, we could all think about unintended consequences.
What to do with Fawlty Towers, John Cleese and ‘ don’t mention the war ‘ skits ?
Should all comedy be thrown away because climate change ? Should all books be banned because of an association with something idiotic ? Decades ago I was warned not to bother reading Hitlers ‘ Mein Kampf ‘. It’s a fact that autobiographies are in general the most unreliable form of self-analysis but in the case of one written by a war criminal, why would anyone bother ?
I know your kidding, but I will respond as though you mean it. Equal time for Nazis would be like equal time for climate deniers, anti-vaxxers, the Ku Klux Klan and paedophiles. As a gay man who is old enough to know what it was like to be regarded as subhuman, my first instinct is to turn the tables. Part of me would really enjoy bashing a White Supremacist. But that would be punching down, because White Supremacists really are subhuman, in the sense that they have failed to mature into the emotionally intelligent beings we are all capable of becoming. They invite contempt and ridicule but they deserve pity and patience – NEVER accommodation.
the abc is in a muddle, just like the bbc. Taking a neutral stand is like watching your best friend burn and all you want to do is let her burn. Its chased murdoch down the rabbit holes. Stories about cats in the news. Stories about king charles or his kids makes the news. Seriously, i dont bother anymore. 730 report used to be riveting theatre. Even that BS about everything, insiders has taken a downturn by recasting all the familiar faces as experts. When i hear them talk, its all insider knowledge as if they are harvard grads. Nobody seriously questions the status quo. Paul smith, you wont win with kindness. Those narcissits need to be beaten into submission before they beat you. As much as i am a pacifist, reality is hard lesson. personally, a nazi salute does nothing for me, one way or another. Its the implied threats these thugs trade on. Its time we stopped being the nice country that runs on rules. Cause how i see it, the thugs know how to bend the rules in their favour. But of coarse, a couple of climate protestors will get 18months of jail time, wont they. Tough on crime alright. all talk.
Down at the coffee shop, David and I saluted each other in the time honoured way, and then fell about laughing.
This is important stuff we admitted, in 2023, with everything else that is falling apart.
Then we moved onto sorting out the world our way.
I get Gemini and Janus mixed up but I am influenced by mercury and Venus who bless me with wits and charm. Perhaps astrology is bull….?? ps Hitler is not long gone he is in the thoughts of millions. To them he made the train leave on time and Jews, slave, dole bludgers , the infirm and unions need destroying. pps My memory, I love my country I honour the queen I salute her flag – how did you salute?? I promise to obey her laws god save our gracious queen God save our noble queen Send her victorious Happy and glorious Long to reign over us(how true) God save the queen.
Stand to attention
Hand on heart
90 degree Stop signal
Extended arm quasinazi??