What will it take for the Greens to be ‘mainstream’?

May 6, 2015
Written by: Dr Victoria Fielding
73 Replies

After today’s shock Greens leadership change, new leader Richard Di Natale has been quoted as saying he wants the Greens to be ‘the natural home of progressive mainstream Australian voters’. Fine. I can see where Di Natale is going with this. This is code for ‘I want the Greens to challenge Labor as the left-wing major party’. The Greens have always wanted to replace Labor and now Di Natale is being more straight talking about this than previous Greens leaders Milne and Brown. But what does this mean for the Greens, this new ‘mainstream’ mission? I’ve got a suggestion as to what the Greens will have to do in order to make this statement more meaningful than an election slogan.

Mainstream political parties cannot pretend they are above politics.

From what I can tell, a large appeal of the Greens to Greens voters is that they are not a ‘political party’ in the sense that they eschew the messiness and politicking of the Labor Party and the Liberal National Coalition. Whereas Labor, Liberal and the Nationals are portrayed by the Greens as being full of politicians, who act politically, the Greens like to frame themselves as above all this nonsense, and as real people who really get the electorate and what the mainstream progressives want. However, being a pure, uncompromising, non-negotiating non-politician, and appealing to mainstream voters is not, in my view, possible to do at the same time. Because politics, and more importantly, getting things done in politics is by its very nature, a political process.

Show me someone who’s never had to behave politically and I’ll show you someone who talks a lot but achieves nothing. There is politics in all productive action, from debating, negotiating and compromising with your children about what time they should go to bed to positioning yourself for a promotion at work, to running a large multi-national corporation. It may sound crass, and I’m sorry to break the hearts of the bleeding hearts who refuse to believe the world works the way it does, but the tooth fairy doesn’t exist. Shit doesn’t get done without political nous – and this means giving in to the understanding that achieving something is better than achieving nothing, that sometimes you don’t get exactly what you want, that compromise and negotiation is an inevitable reality of mainstream politics and that, to use the philosophy of Tony Judt, sometimes the best we can hope for is incremental improvement to unsatisfactory circumstances. The mainstream do not want revolution and if you try to push it down their throats, you’ll soon learn just how much they don’t want it. What are some of the practicalities of this reality for the Greens? Here are a few:

The Greens need to release a fully costed budget reply that shows exactly how they will fund their policies and what tax will be paid by various segments of the community in order to make all these policies actually happen. The mainstream care a lot about how much tax they pay. Whether you like this or not, it’s inescapable.
The Greens need to stop taking credit for policies that they didn’t create. Sure, they can pat themselves on the back for voting for a policy they like, but this is a different concept than actually stealing the credit for Labor policies that Labor has developed, Labor has got through the parliament (through a political process) and Labor has implemented.
Related to the above, if the Greens want to be able to take credit for their own policies, they need to implement policies, not just ideas. When I step out my door every morning, I can see Labor policies everywhere. Public transport. Health services. Public schools. Maternity leave. Workers’ rights. Infrastructure. Labor policies touch every aspect of my life. Greens ideas might sound nice, but they amount to little more than soundbites, or thin air if you like, until they are actually implemented.
On the subject of policies, a mainstream Greens party will need to acknowledge that a mainstream political party cannot ignore that they need to have a working relationship with business. It’s all very well to wish and hope, as some Greens supporters seem to, that businesses would just pay more tax and not pollute the environment, and not treat their workers badly, and keep creating jobs and keep investing in the economy without political parties working hand-in-hand with them to get the best outcomes for everyone. This is never going to happen. Working constructively with the business sector is a political reality of mainstream politics and if the Greens don’t recognise this, they’re not a mainstream political party, they’re a lobby group or perhaps an activist organisation.
Lastly, the inflexible positions that the Greens have taken in some policy areas will need to be more compromising if they are to appeal to mainstream Australians. For instance, it’s not good enough to just say ‘we can solve the asylum seeker policy by just letting everyone come by boat’ and ignoring deaths at sea. It’s not good enough to simply say that there will be a cap on the number of humanitarian visas, and that if that quota, however high it is, is filled up with people who can afford to pay a people smuggler, and are lucky enough not to drown on the journey, who ultimately take the place of someone who may be just as desperate yet can’t afford a boat journey, then so be it. Bottom line is, there is no simple solution to complex policy problems such as the arrival of asylum seekers, and a mainstream political party should be able to discuss this type of problem without being accused of being heartless, murdering, bastards. Are the Greens up for this challenge? Are they ready to stop screaming in people’s faces when they try to discuss achievable solutions?

I guess this advice leaves me with two final questions. If the Greens were able to achieve all of the above, how would they be any different from Labor? And would Greens voters still support them? And I’ll throw in a final question just to keep the conversation interesting: do we, as intelligent, progressive, mainstream voters really think it’s a good idea to use all our political courage, resources, money, support, motivation and energy to split the progressive vote, to fight a war amongst ourselves? If someone could tell me how this stops Tony Abbott winning the next election, I would be interested to hear it.

Like what we do at The AIMN?

You’ll like it even more knowing that your donation will help us to keep up the good fight.

Chuck in a few bucks and see just how far it goes!

Your contribution to help with the running costs of this site will be gratefully accepted.

You can donate through PayPal or credit card via the button below, or donate via bank transfer: BSB: 062500; A/c no: 10495969

Post Views: 202

73 comments

Login here

Register here

ruthMay 6, 2015 at 8:27 pm

Yes I agree, we would now have a carbon trading scheme if they had negotiated with labour

Marian SainesMay 6, 2015 at 8:55 pm

my understanding ( and I believe Richard stated this today) is the Greens have already prepared there own fully- costed budget.
I am really fed up today with journalists patronising the Greens: you have done it here in spades Victoria, Leigh Sales did it on 7:30 Report and Chris Uhlmann did it throughout coverage of Christine Milnes’s resignation and whilst awaiting the Greens Leadership announcement.
I can only come to the view that many Journalist are in a cosy club with the two- party system and don’t want Interlopers. you will have good reason to modify your tone with Mr Di Natale and the Greens as time goes by.

John FraserMay 6, 2015 at 9:12 pm

Victoria Rollinson

"The Greens have always wanted to replace Labor.."

Breaking news !

No one gives a rats arse about Shorten and the Labor party with him captaining the good ship "Labor Titanic".

DanDarkMay 6, 2015 at 9:19 pm

I voted for the Greens for the first time ever in a recent by-election in Victoria, I had no other choice really Labor didn’t even put a candidate forward to vote for, all the other candidates were either the liberal party or other idiots.
I will continue to vote for the Greens or an acceptable independent because Labor has helped Phony Tony and Co bring in some draconian laws and have forgotten their base of voters for years now.
Mr Di Natale has leadership qualities that already shows through,
he is a threat to labor and Phony Tony and they know it,
and the attack will start on the man and his party, out come the knives and the dirt files…….

eli nesMay 6, 2015 at 9:46 pm

labor colourless tasteless and odourless, The greens under milne lunatics.
Now they need to do nothing except to have a laugh at the major parties in order to regain the balance and if they can perform a less loony DLP – style challenge they will sink little billy and labor.

silkwormMay 6, 2015 at 10:00 pm

That’s right. The Greens should drop their compassionate stand against the Abbott govt’s “turn back the boats” policy and join with the Labor party in adopting the Libs’ cruel policies towards asylum seekers, er, I mean, illegal immigrants. Now that’s mainstream!

Oh, and thank you, Victoria, a Labor voter, for sticking your nose into the business of a more progressive party than your own.

Matters NotMay 6, 2015 at 10:03 pm

I openly admit to having ‘sympathy’ with the Greens and usually give them my first preference (and therefore effectively voting for Labor) but I wonder why they:

need to release a fully costed budget reply that shows exactly how they will fund their policies and what tax will be paid by various segments of the community in order to make all these policies actually happen. The mainstream care a lot about how much tax they pay

Wow. Perhaps one might provide some historical example(s) where that was ever done and where the numbers were actually valid?

Simply, the Greens and other Oppositional parties don’t have the resources to go down that track. Sure we now have the Parliamentary Budget Office but to expect that Office to respond in any short time-frame is unrealistic.

Re the Greens, you set the bar too high.

At the same time, re the ALP, you set the bar too low.

BruceMMay 6, 2015 at 10:26 pm

I think diNatale made good point about the available consciencious conservatives / small L liberals. The policies Victoria refers to as Labor are historical not current – she neglects to discuss the vacuum of progressive policy in Labor ranks now – and what about Gillard putting single mums on newstart? Labor faltering is what has the Greens trying to stand up. Rather than splitting progressive vote, I think the Greens can and will articulate progressive values in a way that can invigorate Labor who have become ingrained with the neocon stench from the NSW right. Shorten is equal with Abbott as preferred PM (unthinkable – neck and neck with a psychopathic liar?) for a reason – he is a vacuum of progressive ideas. There are many outcomes to the ascendancy of the Greens – a labor/greens coalition is one that would definitely empower a period of progressive reform without the sort of gutless pandering to the centre-right that Labor have been doing for a decade or two.

Rod StebbingMay 6, 2015 at 10:31 pm

What a sad piece; if this represents the views of a “true believer” it is small wonder that the Labor Party fails to engender greater enthusiasm.

Annie BMay 6, 2015 at 10:39 pm

Nothing wrong with a bit of old-fashioned competition between mates. …. I don’t think for one moment, the Greens wish to undermine the Labor camp or ‘replace it’, but rather to perhaps fill in the gaps that Labor is currently showing … because the Greens – at this time cannot hope to win outright, the leadership of this country.

So – whether they argue between themselves or not – it is a win / win situation for the left of centre progressive thinking people in this nation, towards the future.

Have to say sadly, that your article Victoria, sounds too right wing for my liking and you certainly have ‘patronised them ( the Greens ) in spades’ here …. but then it’s your right to see them whatever way you want to …. and to write about it. !!

Politics – no matter who anyone follows, still remains the dirtiest ” legal” ?? game in the country / the world. …..

It is refreshing to see someone like Di Natale with at least an ability to ‘over-talk’ the likes of Leigh Sales …. ( she interrupts ‘guests’ every other 1/8th minute !! ) and I just hope it is not a honeymoon stage for him at this time; that his ideals particularly for equality, better-best health considerations, and upward living standards for all Australians – continues. …. Not to mention his stand against the ridiculous notions the LNP have about climate change.

We shall see …………

paul walterMay 6, 2015 at 11:00 pm

I agree with much of what Victoria Rollison says, but it must be added that the ALP appears too close to neoliberalism these days for that to sit well on the stomachs of many thinking people.

Labor also has to compromise a bit, or certainly act a bit more open mindedly than they did over native old growth forests, for example.
Their failure to do this in the early nineties and since is actually the factor that largely ensured the (probably necessary) survival of the Greens, even if this meant them being a thorn in the side of the bigger party, with its addiction to expediency and apparent lack of political consciousness.

Sometimes, the vested interests also need to compromise a bit also.

FreeThinkerMay 6, 2015 at 11:34 pm

Seems to me, the Greens are the only Australian Party with principled opposition to the practices of asylum seeker children being locked up in appalling conditions in off-shore detention centres for months or years. That has been their consistent position for 15 years. Their views are not mainstream opinion in Australia, but the Greens stance is in line with the UN Human Rights Conventions, to which Australia seems to have become a desultory signatory.

How is it we can we effect such awfulness on children ?

Part of the answer perhaps lies in our historical precedents.

As a nation in the early 20th century, we found ways to seriously traumatise thousands of Aboriginal children (and their parents).

As we are finding out now via the Royal Commission on Child Abuse (and elsewhere), the guardians of disadvantaged youth in mid 20th century and later, often subjected their young charges to practices of deep cruelty and to different forms of serious and serial abuse.

In channelling our worst cultural memes, we seem intent since 1999, in doing something similar with asylum seeker children.

The Greens provide some welcome relief from the grey conceptual policy mediocrity of the two major parties in this country, and their rationalised cruelties.

Greens influence will grow however, as it is youth that are more attracted to their policies.

Di Natale as leader, is a positive development for them.

kgb16May 6, 2015 at 11:38 pm

GO GREENS! We need a Party that isn’t beholden to the CSG & coal mining industries. The ALP & LNP receive so much in donations and personal benefits, they will not act in the interests of Australia and totally ban CSG and new coal mining. They are destroying our water, our land (farmland, forests etc.), wild life, Great Artesian Basin, Great Barrier Reef to name part of the destruction. Both those large Parties have a sorry record, including the legal crimes exposed by the ICAC, which unfortunately is only in exitence in NSW and is extremely vulnerable thanks to weak legislation. The Labor Party needs a thorough clean out, and the LNP appears to be beyond hope with regard to decency, equity and people working in Australia’s interests.

Matt JamesMay 7, 2015 at 12:15 am

A thought provoking column, I’m pretty much along the lines of Paul Walter here.

A stand out example of Labor totally selling out is the role they have played in paving the way for Health Insurance Giant, Bupa’s public health system takeover.

Labor were so aggreable on this in Bupa’s Chief Medical Officer at the time, Dr. Christine Bennet, Chaired the
National Health and Hospitals Reform Commission released in 2009, a far reaching review of the entire health system.
Ultimately pretty much a waste of time and money, thank god for that. Here’s one of the headings:

“Rethinking the universal service entitlement”

So Medicare is no longer a basic right, its now a privilege. Here’s an extract:

“One element of this community debate about the universal service entitlement is creating greater
transparency and public understanding about spending on health. We currently live in a ‘magic
pudding’ world. We ‘see’ that 1.5 per cent of our taxable income goes toward the ‘Medicare Levy’,
yet many people do not realise that governments spend much more than this.”

Now the 1.5% number is very misleading but that has nothing to do with Universal health funding, but she subtley points the finger, “Medicare is not a Magic Money Tree…” snake skin underhand Insurance speak at its most vial.

All of this con act revolved around driving through Bupa’s bait and switch, Medicare Select. If they succeded in pulling it off all Aust citizens would have had to take out Private Health Insurance with Medicare reimbursing the Insurer. That would have planted these criminals right in the center of the health system.

What a hideous, cynical banker driven NEO CON Labor party that is. This is where a party like The Greens can show up how compromised a mainstream party has become. That said, I don’t recall The Greens making much of a song & dance about it but I would need to confirm.

Either way I’m hoping The Greens will start getting on Bupa’s case pretty soon, they are setting up a global criminal enterprise, its that black and white.

JexpatMay 7, 2015 at 12:43 am

I’ve got news for you Victoria- it’s far more often than not, on both the local & state level- as well as the federal level, that Labor takes credit for polcies that the Greens have developed and often spent many, many years advocating and doing the heavy lifting for.

I see it right here in my own community, where a Labor/Green coalition now controls council, thanks to ICAC revelations and a series of byelections. We don’t mind that much really, because we are in fact (and as Di Natali said today) interested in outcomes, far more than any sort of credit.

As to the rest of the article- it read like a litanny of “mainstream” media talking points. Sadly vacuous, ill supported and tasting of sour Labor grapes.

Having said that, I’ll reiterate the often made point that we (The Greens and Labor) cannot defeat the right wing ideologues in the LNP without working together tactically and strategically.

lindsaymsMay 7, 2015 at 1:11 am

@BruceM
Gillard putting single mums on newstart?
That was the last straw as far as I was concerned, I doubt that Labor (at least in its present incarnation) will ever get my first preference again.

Perhaps The Greens will never be able to govern in their own right but very vote that drifts from Labor to The Greens sends a message the we want Labor to return back to the left. (or maybe at least to centre right). currently we seem to have a right wing major party and an extreme right wing major party.

Personally I don’t think that Labor will ever govern in its own right again and we will probably end up with a LAB/ Green coalition and a Lib/Nat coalition with a substantial amount of the drift being from Nat supporters to Greens. The Nats no longer represent the agricultural side of the rural community.

DanDarkMay 7, 2015 at 1:37 am

Bruce said “Gillard putting single mums on newstart?
That was the last straw as far as I was concerned, I doubt that Labor (at least in its present incarnation) will ever get my first preference again.”

Yep that was the last straw for me too, I wrote to her and expressed my disgust with her decision to cut single mothers off at the knees after all the studies showing single mums were already doing it tough, then she banters on about girls and education, well she had no idea what it takes to raise a child let alone a female in this country
as well as to educate them at the cost of education these days,
the hypocrisy coming from her was gob smacking at the least, it was a disaster of a decision made by her and Labor for my family being a single Mum paying a mortgage and many more thousands of single parents just trying to give their kids a decent life an education and a roof over their heads, this country is in a sad state of affairs and has been for a long while now…..

JimboMay 7, 2015 at 4:30 am

What an ignorant ill-informed piece.

paul walterMay 7, 2015 at 5:51 am

Why is that, Jimbo?

paul walterMay 7, 2015 at 6:18 am

Third try : wtf is wrong with AIM’s posting system?

Rollinson does make several mistakes, the worst being to fall for the old idea that big business is always right. When it threatens the sustainable base involving things like gas fracking, deforestation and the water resource, it must back down when scientific criticism identifies real world problems and community concerns are justified on a rational basis. No more neoliberalism.

It is a pity the Greens have forgotten their original raison d’etre, but even they are in front of the major parties as to most of these things.

With asylum seekers, the advocates must realise that global poverty and asylum seeking are issue that can’t be solved just by Australia.
What is really needed is for the Big Powers and the mega rich to cease resource wars that create refugee flows, waste $trillions on defence spending and instead have money instead put into the the Third World to ensure life becomes bearable for hundreds millions of people-at source- so they are not forced to flee from where they now live.

On the other hand, the egregious brutality and political footballing concerning the asylum seeker system must surely be put an end to immediately and those already detained here or offshore, or marooned in Indonesia and Malaysia are finally dealt with fairly and efficaciously.

mikestasseMay 7, 2015 at 6:26 am

IF there’s one thing I dislike about Di Natale it’s………. that he’s mainstream. The mainstream is going straight over the cliff from here. We need to turn the flow sideways, and nobody’s doing that….

Kaye LeeMay 7, 2015 at 7:25 am

This was released in November 2012 and will no doubt be updated before the next election:

The Australian Greens will raise an extra $41.2 billion of revenue to invest in education, healthcare, clean energy and more, by:

Fixing the mining tax, so the multi-national mining corporations pay their fair share for mining our natural resources. An improved mining tax will raise $20.8 billion over the three years from 1 July 2014.

Abolishing tax breaks for the fossil fuel industry and assistance to carbon capture and storage programmes. This will raise an additional $12 billion over the forward estimates.

Introducing a Public Support Levy on the big banks. A 20 basis point levy on bank assets over $100 billion will raise $7.9 billion over the three years from 1 July 2014.

Increasing the effective marginal tax rate on incomes over $1 million. Increasing the effective rate to 50 per cent from 1 July 2014 will raise $500 million over the forward estimates.

LeeMay 7, 2015 at 8:08 am

Congratulations Victoria. I didn’t think it was possible for you to write more verbal diarrhoea praising Labor and dissing the Greens, but it appears you can.

The Greens have always been willing to work with Labor, Labor isn’t interested in working with the Greens. Labor often won’t recommend that preferences go to Greens on their how to vote cards.

Keep on voting for people who are more concerned with feathering their own nest by pandering to the big end of town rather than representing people like you. It’s people like you who are giving us the crap government that you deserve.

Kaye LeeMay 7, 2015 at 8:34 am

Politics has taken over from governing. Politicians aren’t experts on anything at all really but, if elected, they have access to the best expert advice available.

Wouldn’t it be nice if we just elected people of integrity who would represent their constituents by both raising local issues and listening to informed advice and then agreeing on the best available course of action on current evidence and future projections.

Does it really matter who comes up with an idea? It seems to me that having mediocre people entering parliament with rigidly set platforms that they must adhere to and argue for regardless of changing circumstances or new developments is detrimental but it is what party politics and career politicians have handed us.

If they all thought of themselves as members of parliament rather than winners and losers would be a good start. If the goals they were trying to achieve were more important than elections and party allegiance we might get somewhere.

AwabakalMay 7, 2015 at 8:50 am

Kevin Andrews on Twitter
‏@kevinandrewsmp

Does it really matter who will lead the freedom hating @Greens? Their anti-family & community destroying policies remain.

Does it really matter who will lead the freedom hating @Greens? Their anti-family & community destroying policies remain #greenspill #auspol

— Kevin Andrews (@kevinandrewsmp) May 6, 2015

And the Roman Catholics wonder why the pews are bare.

The other known is that Nick McKim, currently Tasmanian state Green’s minister, has not ruled out throwing his hat in for a tilt at federal senate. Seriously, this bloke has to be ignored. Two pounds of worthless salt. He is a politician first and foremost and a failed state Green’s leader, responsible for confusing the issues and getting waylaid in the Tasmanian forest outcomes.

LeeMay 7, 2015 at 8:55 am

“Kevin Andrews on Twitter
‏@kevinandrewsmp

Does it really matter who will lead the freedom hating @Greens? Their anti-family & community destroying policies remain.”

Yeah that was rich coming from someone whose party locks kids in detention, fear mongers to turn Australians against each other and wants to collect our metadata – all aided and abetted by the ALP.

LeeMay 7, 2015 at 9:01 am

@Kaye Lee May 7, 2015 at 8:34 am Totally agree with your entire post. When Sir Thomas Playford was the Premier of South Australia, the Labor leader Mick O’Halloran worked with him to achieve many good outcomes for all South Australians. O’Halloran was more concerned with serving the electorate than being in power and reaping lifelong undeserved benefits for himself. Those days are long gone.

tripe whatalotoffMay 7, 2015 at 9:21 am

I am sorry Ms Rollison. What you advocate is for the greens to become just as ethically/morally bankrupt as either of the majors.
If people wanted more of the same bullshit that you promote, they would just vote for the same old tired corruption based parties.

Ricardo29May 7, 2015 at 9:27 am

Like many I appreciate a lot of what Victoria writes but in this instance I agree with all of those who have taken umbrage over her disparagement of the Greens. It has been in the interests of both Labor and the Scumbags to paint the Greens as extremists, with a lot of help from the MSM but like many, I am giving them first prefs where possible because I believe their positions —asylum seekers particularly– align with my feelings and I think that their influence could help a Labor Government back to where it should be on the political/ social spectrum. I thought Di Natale on 7.30 was quite explicit on where some of the money would come from and I thought he handled Leigh Sales contempt pretty well. (Mind you giving him a hard time allows/forces him to show his credentials, which people sometimes forget is one of the roles of an interviewer)

Douglas EvansMay 7, 2015 at 9:31 am

A number of things to say here.

First congratulations to Christine Milne on a fine career in public life. Because of her age she was always going to be a short-term transitional leader of the Federal Party. She had a difficult gig in the last three years replacing the canny, avuncular Bob Brown who had somehow morphed into everybody’s favorite uncle (well perhaps not Victoria’s). She effectively managed a far larger team of talented, energetic, ambitious colleagues than uncle Bob ever had to deal with. In the process, despite constant provocation from the Newscorp rags, she by and large avoided public bickering likely to damage the Party in the eyes of the punters. The most obvious example of her capacity to manage is the smooth, seamless and apparently conflict free baton passing exercise the Greens presented us with yesterday. An object lesson there for the Laborals d’you think Victoria? She came out of an activist background and was a warrior from beginning to end. This was both a strength and a weakness. Confrontation and bloody minded intransigence, necessary when dealing with pulp mills and loggers, isn’t always an effective strategy. Nevertheless, well done Christine.

Richard Di Natale who I have heard speak a few times, is different in style but no less committed and principled. He is a safe pair of hands and a good choice for the Party as it moves forward. Anyone (mikestasse?) fearing that he will be too easily manipulated by the forces of darkness need only to have listened to what he was prepared to say about policy directions (and the manner in which he said it) as the journo’s tried desperately to trip him up yesterday, to be re-assured. The Greens’ determination to stick to process in policy formulation and keep quiet about what is said and done behind closed doors as the political process unfolds is an object lesson for the Laborals don’t you think Victoria?

Victoria trots out the extremely tired old assertion that the Greens pretend they are above politics meaning I presume they state their principles and refuse to negotiate. It may be that this is based on the tired old Labor lie that the Greens refused to negotiate on Rudd’s CPR. Anyone listening to Richard DiNatale yesterday heard the truth spoken on that issue. Rudd as always too clever for his own good, sought to wedge both the Liberals and the Greens on this. He and Penny Wong feeling that they could get what they wanted from Turnbull repeatedly refused to negotiate with Milne and continually lied about it. Yes that nice Penny Wong telling porkies! Who’d have thought it? After the experience of the Gillard years it is difficult to believe anyone would still make this claim but Victoria apparently paid no attention to what was going on. She and many others have been fulsome in their praise of the sainted Julia Gillard for her success in getting so much of a minority Labor Government’s program passed. Well minority governments’ don’t last and don’t get anything done without the co-operation of those who hold the balance of power – in this case this included Adam Bandt who energetically horse-traded and assiduously negotiated amendments where necessary but supported all that legislation that Gillard’s supporters laud so vigorously. You can’t have it both ways. Gillard did OK in difficult circumstances but she did well BECAUSE Mr Bandt with a couple of others engaged in the process. Do catch up Victoria.

Victoria accuses the Greens of taking credit for what is really Labor policy (without giving an example) We are left to guess what she might be referring to but my guess (because I have heard other Labor apologists bleating about it also) is that she is talking about the Clean Energy Legislation. Let’s have a few facts. A Minority Labor Government announced before the election that it had NO INTENTION in its term of office of undertaking any effective action on this vitally important issue. I see the hand of bloody Martin Ferguson a mentor of Gillard’s in this – not that she needed much encouragement . Remember her role in talking Rudd out of taking action on this matter. By virtue of the weakness of the government’s position it was dragged very reluctantly into acting as a condition of support from Bandt, Windsor and Oakeshott. Forced to do something they were confronted with the problem of what that should be. They had no policy in the bottom drawer. Remember they weren’t intending to do anything at all (other than talk) in this term of government. The starting point for the multi-party negotiations was the Greens’ policy. Labor and the independents had nothing. There was no alternative. Brown Labor then got busy watering down and weakening targets. The really useful parts of this legislation, those bits which still survive in fact, were forced on Labor by Milne, Bandt Oakeshott and Windsor as a condition for not walking away from an increasingly compromised process. The Clean Energy legislation was Greens policy distorted by the meddling of the Labor right. Do stop peddling fairy tales Victoria.

More to say but the rest of my life beckons so this’ll have to do.

Kaye LeeMay 7, 2015 at 9:48 am

Failing to recognise Labor’s achievements under Julia Gillard is as bad as dismissing the Greens. This sort of bickering achieves nothing. It’s hardly an example of the negotiation you both so wish to claim party credit for (lord knows why).

For most of us, we would like to see a coming together of Labor and the Greens to agree on goals and work together towards achieving them.

Douglas EvansMay 7, 2015 at 10:15 am

Kaye Lee
You might note that I wrote Julia Gillard did OK in difficult circumstances. I don’t deny the achievements of her government. I simply wanted to point out to the author of this piece that Gillard did what she did because there was co-operation not in spite of the lack of co-operation. As to the Greens and Labor coming together – well tell it to the Labor Party. They HATE the Greens for STEALING votes that they KNOW are RIGHTFULLY THEIRS. That won’t change in our lifetime unless they start to feel their power base slipping further to the Greens at elections. Then we’ll see some movement. But until disappointed Labor voters start to register their disapproval at the ballot box nothing will happen. In Victoria we have a new group, I gather driven by James Button (son of John) called ‘Open Labor’. Modeled on Greens style of activity – plenty of grass roots action and policy discussion, lots of emails into my inbox. They would talk to the Greens but it all ends at the National Conference with the dinosaurs stamping out any movement towards meaningful reform including co-operation with the accursed Greens. ‘Open Labor’ will vanish like ‘Green Labor’ did before them. I bought and read that little book with the funny title ‘Why Labor should savor its Greens’ by Brad Orgill. Perfectly fine logical, reasoned argument in support of reasoned co-operation. Not going to happen. Emotion swamps logic every time.

philgorman2014May 7, 2015 at 10:39 am

The article reveals more about Labor’s problems with promoting social democracy, openness and equity than the Greens. Labor looks more and more like LNP Lite.

While the Greens have made plenty of mistakes they still stick to their principles under pressure, and are learning to make strategic compromises without selling their souls. Labour is so riddled with compromise and corruption by factional, corporate and union bosses that it lacks coherence and credibility. The best are brilliant but the rest are mediocre sell outs.

The Greens could actually be very good for nudging Labour back to its progressive roots by competing for the progressive vote. They might pick up Labor’s dropped torch to re-ignite “the light on the hill”. Australia needs reminding that it was created as an independent commonwealth, not a corporation.

kerriMay 7, 2015 at 12:19 pm

Victoria, I don’t think for a millisecond that The Greens see themselves as taking Government in the next election? Their base is small, but well supported for nearly all the reasons listed by the posts above. They will need time to grow and more members in either house before their time in Government could evolve. Rather like yourself, they will mature over time and grow into an even more worthwhile contributor to Australian life. I for one will be voting Green until I can recognise The Labor Party that was once the light on the hill and the party of the worker and the party of the left, the non religious, the environmetally concerned, the socially conscienced.

townsvilleblogMay 7, 2015 at 12:57 pm

Victoria, it must be noted that over a million Australians vote for The Greens in the Senate, those votes are reality. The Labor Party is viewed by many to be a weak conservative driven party, certainly not progressive led by a former right wing union official who achieved his position via a gerrymander. Obviously many Labor voters vote Green in the Senate for a reason. Whether The Greens become a mainstream party will be due to the performance of the ALP under BS. Obviously the goal is to rid Australia of the ultra right wing LNP power brokers who are crushing we poverty driven pensioners, after having a look through The Greens policies, I don’t see much that I disagree with, luckily the ALP have a good candidate in my electorate so I’ll probably stick with Labor this time, the future of The Greens will probably hinge on Richard Di Natile and his representation.

townsvilleblogMay 7, 2015 at 1:04 pm

philgorman2014 the old bogie man ‘union bosses’ is pretty funny in this day and age. Union bosses are just people who have worked their way to the head of their organizations – the organizations who represent employees against the dark forces of extreme capitalism – you know the people who collectively rob the Australia Treasury of approximately $10 Billion each and every year.