That's the story of, that's the glory of…

Fifty years ago, the film Guess Who’s Coming to Dinner challenged social…

Day to Day Politics: “IT'S TIME” – Marriage…

Sunday 24 September 2017 At the time of writing the following countries supported…

Australia's shameful treatment of refugees and asylum seekers…

By Julie Grint Many issues about human rights are dear to me as…

Benjamin Netanyahu, Penguins and the United Nations

“That’s why Israel’s policy regarding the nuclear deal with Iran is very…

Bernardi and Abbott: a shared pyschosis

And the week finished on a spectacularly self-mutilating note for the No…

The strategies of a madman

By Dr George Venturini Heinz Alfred ‘Henry’ Kissinger obtained a Ph.D. at Harvard…

Subsidies, blackouts and rising energy prices, but it…

While the Coalition blame blackouts and rising energy prices on renewable energy…

Day to Day Politics: Is Tony never to…

Saturday 23 September 2017 In writing this I will probably be accused of…

«
»
Facebook

You Bloody Idiots!

There is madness in the air and to deliberately mis-quote George Santayana, those that do not pay attention to history are bound to repeat it. That is exactly what Tony Abbott and his government are doing and why should we expect anything different from someone who is so devoid of anything original all he can do is follow the leader like sheep follow the shepherd.

Paul McGeough’s analysis in Monday’s Age newspaper is spot on. Fools rush in where wise men would bide their time. Tony Abbott is sending 600 military personnel and eight ageing aircraft into a conflict with no idea what he is getting involved in, what the strategy is, or what the time frame is. My only reaction when I heard this latest piece of news was to say, ‘You bloody idiots’.

isilWhat does he seriously think 8 jets and 200 military advisors can do? More importantly, was he asleep during the first decade of this century? How many jets does Saudi Arabia have? How many does Egypt have? What about Iran, Jordan, Turkey? What are they doing to intervene in this conflict? This is their turf; their area of responsibility. Would any of those countries send their jets to Fiji or Samoa or Nauru if there was an outbreak of unspeakable violence there?

In an area of the world where conflict has been raging in one form or another for over 1000 years, where kingdoms and dictatorships have been the norm, where paper thin democracies struggle to define themselves, are we going to save them from themselves?

I think not!

How simple-minded this government is. How pathetic is the Labor opposition that so meekly falls into line as if there was no other position it could take. I well remember how staunchly Labor opposed the war in Vietnam and our involvement in it. Arthur Calwell stood firm. Gough Whitlam stood firm. In the end they were right. Their views prevailed. But not before the Liberal government continued to increase our commitment to that conflict and not before 500 Australian soldiers died in a civil war that even our current Governor-General, himself a decorated military man, said was a mistake. How many of our soldiers died in Afghanistan and for what? Does anyone seriously think Afghanistan is stable? Does anyone seriously think the Taliban are defeated?

heraldWhere are the voices of dissent now? Who will oppose this absurd decision? Don’t look to the mainstream media. Monday’s headline in the Herald-Sun tells us quite clearly where their support lies. ‘Ready for War’. Really? You stupid, stupid people.

I would not even give Abbott the credit for doing this as a means of saving his political hide. That would be praising him.  He just isn’t that smart. This is pure Santamaria ideology. But Labor should know better. They ended our involvement in Vietnam. They have a conscience.They should know better.


163 comments

  1. Nick

    Sadly I absolutely concur 🙁

  2. Kath Malcom

    A lot of mainstream media take a lot of stupid pills on a daily basis, most have overdosed on them, Tony is keeping a running supply for them, handing them out like lollies, this will only end badly for journos who propagate stupidity on a daily basis,
    stone the crows, or stone the journos, but it will end in tears for the bloody idiots…

  3. Roswell

    Maybe each slain soldier could be worth 10,000 votes.

  4. Jeanette

    I agree, just plain stupid, it’s about testosterone loaded political posturing. I think Tony Abbott is enraptured with the thought he is the hero of the moment and with guns ablaze he will defeat the “baddies”, from his own lips. Until more body bags come back. Of course Iraq has oil!

  5. David Stephens

    Recently saw the resurrected great movie Allies, made by Marian Wilkinson in 1983, in which Marshall Green, US Ambassador here during the Whitlam Government, said President Johnson regarded Australia as ‘the next large rectangular shaped state west of El Paso, Texas’. Nothing has changed. Uncle Sam doesn’t even have to call before we roll over. On the facts in the piece, you are right about Arthur Calwell’s position (NB spelling) but too generous to Gough. He was very equivocal on Vietnam and conscription until it was clear which way the wind was blowing c. 1970-71. Jim Cairns and Tom Uren were vocal from the start. Shorten is channeling Gough 1967; pity no-one is channeling Jim.

  6. Truth Seeker

    John, well said, and Bloody oath!

  7. Reg

    Following past experience this is unbelievable. But you could see it coming through the intent to purchase of war machinery months ago. I thought Australians would be wiser by now.

  8. Alistair Parr

    The idea that the ALP had of keeping out of Vietnam was obviously the right idea…

    But making reference to the ALP of old to the ALP of today is not a sensible idea.

    The modern day ALP is LNP “lite”.
    Especially with Shorten running the party.

    Democracy as we once knew it dead. ALP leaders like Shorten and Rudd are just as right wing as any LNP minister.

    Like ’em or hate ’em, Muslims have a point, democracy is an illusion. True.

    Vote for the opposition, you get the same, so that makes you vote for the (other) opposition and again, you get the same.

  9. Jimmy

    Shorten should be calling the people to march NOW AGAINST — WALKING INTO ANOTHER STUPID LNP WAHA –SAVE OUR KIDS LIVES– they will understand in a few years why we did it —

  10. marwill10

    John, you say “Labor has a conscience.They should know better.” Well, it has disappeared since Shorten became leader. He is a disgrace and if he remains in his position much longer we can wave goodbye to winning the next election.

  11. gonemango

    How do we get Julia back?

  12. Kath Malcom

    Yep I have been waiting and waiting and am still waiting for Shorten to lift his game, but nope he just hasn’t got the oomph we need to stop captain chaos in his tracks, phoney is a master at misinformation and will continue to steam roll labor if they sit back and mumble about this and that, and that’s all shorten can manage is a mumble,
    god I could take him by the scruff of the neck some days slap him around the cheeks and say wake up Shorten, Australia is sinking while labor is slumbering,
    get someone in with some bright ideas how to counteract phoney and punch him around the ring from one corner to the other, just like phoney did to Julia, they seem scared of what phoney can do to them, and that’s understandable from past dirty political displays by the Coal ition bullis, but if you can’t handle the heat get out of the kitchen and go find another job behind a desk, cos they are failing as an opposition to this most woeful Gov we have ever seen in this country,
    things are collapsing everywhere because they are a pack of ideological zealots not politicians running the country for the greater good, they are just the puppets for the bigger fish with the help of murdochs minions….

  13. keerti

    I doubt that Julia or any other labour leader would stay out of arse-licking uncle sam.The whole 2 1/2 party system needs to be swept out. in fact i think the party system itself needs to go. how can you call our system a democracy when mp’s first allegiance is to their party rather than their electors?

  14. mark delmege

    Yes Keerti Julia gave Darwin to the Yanks. And Obama wants to give more arms to his ‘good’ death squads in Syria – you couldn’t make this stuff up. Just take note of every politician and media jockey who talks this up.

  15. Florence nee Fedup

    What worries me, is the comment that Shorten made, that it was Abbott that briefed him. Sorry, only briefings should come from security direct. If this is not happening, we need to be concerned.
    .

    Surely Shorten could not be that naïve?

  16. Kath Malcom

    Yep Julia and Obama were pretty chummy, too chummy, a lot of hand holding, kissing, happy banter between them, god it was bloody vomit material, America give huge amounts of supposed aid money to Saudia Arabia, um why is that I wonder, America are like an octopus slithering their tentacles far and wide, and at home they have a police force that is militarised and mad men running around gunning down class rooms of little kiddies,
    an unemployment and homeless rate and crime rate that it has no excuse for really, but can spend big big bucks on other countries and aid them, invade them,
    Uncle Sam in full swing once again the power house pfffttt pfft and pfffttt
    America has been a lost soul for years they need to reflect inwards for a change and not out wards….a few be headings in another country seems to take precedence over their own gun wielding terrorists who gunned down little kids and their teachers in hard cold murder, a cinema full of people the list goes on….wake up America….

  17. stephengb2014

    How many lives and how many Dollars will this one cost
    we know who pays with their lives and limbs, and we know who pays the price
    but who are we paying the price to!

  18. Terry2

    This extract from the Telegraph UK sums up what our own media refuse to acknowledge :

    “Australia: Tony Abbott has been strident in his calls for the West to confront Isil, calling the group “pure evil” and saying the execution of hostage “abundantly justifies” Australian military intervention. Australia has said F-18 Superhornets could be used to bomb Isil targets or escort other allied aircraft. Like Francois Hollande, Mr Abbott is struggling domestically and is eager to pivot to foreign policy as a way of projecting strength. Australian aircraft based in the United Arab Emirates have already begun flying aid missions and delivering cargo loads of weapons to the Kurds.”

  19. Möbius Ecko

    Islamic State: Australia to deploy military force to UAE to prepare for international action against militants in Iraq

    Correction.

    Eight fighter aircraft. Not that ageing as newer Super Hornets, not old Classic Hornets.
    One AWACS (Wedgetail)
    One airborne refuelling tanker.
    400 personnel to support air assets.
    200 troops, probably special forces.

    This doesn’t include the airlift aircraft and military personnel already in the ME.

    Oh, and by the way Abbott said we are not going to war or we at war. I guess he defines war as destroying Labor and unions, war on drugs, war on crime, war on Australian workers, etc. But actually military attacks undertaken against an organised military in another nation is not war.

  20. Giveittoustraight

    ARE U GUYS FOR REAL? What happened to humanity! Innocent people are being executed in the thousands and u think we should just sit back because we live in the lucky country? How nieve are u all. This is a terrorist organisation that loves doing things only the devil himself would consider. How can we as a nation sit back and let that happen. Would u sit back and watch a bully beat the crop out of another child and not step in…..sounds like most of you would let that happen. All you guys with independent views I expected much more from you. You can talk the talk from behind youreally computers but Abbott is walking the walk……why should we avoid this problem now and leave it up to our children to deal with!

  21. Kath Malcom

    There is no devil, so that theory is blown out of the water,, emotional rhetoric yes, devil, evil, death cult, all very emotional rhetoric to con folk into a false sense of fear.
    but hey if there is a devil Giveitathought there is only one devil and it’s toxic Tony, how many of our young people will starve to death, if he cuts the dole for 6 months, how many elderly will die, because they ain’t got 7 bucks to see a quack, how many young people will miss out on uni degree cos of poodle grub pyne, how many people will be ripped off by frauds in the finance sector again, god the toxic list goes on..
    You know what thought thought, he was wrong every time, thinking was your first mistake hey Giveitabreak 🙂

  22. stephentardrew

    John:

    I fully concur with your sentiments. Short sharp and to the point. If only MSM could be so clear and precise.

  23. Kath Malcom

    Nieve is spelt Naive just for the record, if you are going accuse somebody of being something get the friggin word and spelling right, give that a thought mate 🙂

  24. gay o'connor

    Hey, giveittoustraight – did we hear you yelling about the West when it last “sat back and watch a bully beat the crap out of another child and not step in . . . sounds like most of us DID let that happen.” In Gaza. And you spoke out against that . . . ?

  25. stephentardrew

    John:

    All this talk of Santamaria is like a bad nightmare returning to haunt me. What a vile creature he was. Abbott and Santamaria fit together like a gloves oozing with religious fervor and despotic ideological fanaticism. Someone save us from this vile torment.

  26. Cheeky Pohm

    I am appalled by what is happening to us, all over again, like lambs to the slaughter, believing every word they tell us …

    This is not the age of terror, not even close. The real age of terror was the 1970’s. I remember hearing bombs go of in my home town, as they did almost every day in someone’s home town, courtesy of the IRA.

    In Ireland one mob or the other set off a half dozen devices every single day, as well as ‘disappearing’ people; taking them from their beds, their place of work or on the way back from the pub.

    The Spanish had ETA, the Basque separatists, as well as the Catalans. Germany had Bader-Meinhoff, Black September, the US had the SLA, there was Carlos the Jackal, the Greeks had November 11th, plus the numerous other ‘outlaw’ gangs of terrorists all over Europe. And don’t forget the PLO and all of their Libyan sponsored, Soviet backed splinter groups hijacking planes on a weekly basis.

    The 1970’s were the age of terror, today, in the western world, have never been safer. And if we stopped f*cking in third world countries, they might get to enjoy some of this peace as well.

  27. stephentardrew

    Giveittoustraight:

    Provide a strategic plan for success unifying Arab nations and Western powers that will bring some resolution to the middle East. You will need to bone up on geography and history and when you are finished lets all view your highly enlightened dissertation. We will then disseminate it amongst world powers to solve the endless wars and conflict in the Middle East.

    I will then stand in awe at your insightful wisdom and knowledge.

  28. Kath Malcom

    Stephen did you hear about the skeleton they found sitting on a park bench, they were waiting for someone to save them 🙂 if you wait for someone to save you/us we could be waiting long time, yes a life time,
    only we can save ourselves, old saying “the devil you know is better than the devil you don’t know”
    we know toxic tony, and we need to save ourselves or be saved by worse than what is running the country,
    um ah er um ahh errr ahh just doing myTony impersonation it’s sooo easy
    “um err um devil, ahh er um er ahh um evil, um ahhh ,death cult ahhh errr ummm” like the likes of Clive cut em down palmer or even worse, we cannot leave a vacuum of power, it ends badly always..

  29. Kath Malcom

    Giveittoustraight lol lol tooo funny, that made my day 🙂 giveusnothingandtakeusnowhere is how I would describe Giverofwisdom lol

  30. khtagh

    If Abbott doesn’t get the lift in the polls he thinks he will get from his chest thumping be prepared for the manufactured terror bombing here, if Abbott cant scare enough people with his words he will!! resort to physical actions here. It might not go bang, but will be found in time (conveniently). Just what this man is capable of scares the crap out of me, remember he is not an Australian in his heart, he is still a pom. If he thinks a dead soldier is “Shit happens” how little would be his regards for the odd civilian death to suit his self interested political purposes. I hope I’m wrong, but doubt I am.

  31. kerrilmail

    I could not agree more John Kelly. In fact I wish I had written this excellent piece, having just written a letter I intend emailing in reply to the various Labor politicians whose bulk emails I recieve. I will not vote Labot again after this. I wish I had some way of curing the nation of the pox that is Abbott.

  32. Kath Malcom

    He has no heart nor soul, he is a ken doll very plastic, and made by Mattel Inc these days, he is a brand and nothing else, he stands for the LNP brand and sells it as hard as he can with his big finance backers
    He mocked a dying Bernie Banter, this bloke we call PM is as low as a yellow belly snake gets…
    And he always speaks with his forked tongue….

  33. mars08

    “Naturally the common people don’t want war. Neither in Russia, nor in England, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship… Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

    ~Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering. April 18, 1946. (as published in the book, Nuremburg Diary)

  34. Roswell

    Shorten is doing the Abbott trick of pandering to populism. Has he not seen the polls in this: over 65% are against sending in the troops.

    I can’t remember where I saw the poll, but it wasn’t on a Murdoch site.

  35. Kaye Makovec

    I just wish all politicians would get off the well endowed butts and actually do some research BEFORE making decisions.

    We had all of this crap under Howard and they all saw what happened there but because of their own inadequacies feel the urge to assert themselves in what they think is a manly way.

    Real men Think before acting. Sigh!

  36. Helen Jennings

    Once again John – you write succinctly what I have been thinking. I’m so tired and angry with the lnp and my disappointment and despair at Labor’s inept, pathetic responses and actions to the chaos that is happening in our country is now overwhelming me on a daily basis. The lnp has to be stopped and this insane warmongering is only going to create more threats to Australia – scabbott and his gang are putting Australia in harms way in every aspect. STAND UP LABOR and make a difference NOW.

  37. lawrencewinder

    This is going to backfire very, very badly. The divisiveness this putrid man sows is going to destroy what’s left of our civil society. We have been guilty of assisting in making Iraq a bloody mess and now Rabbutt-the-Hun wants to replicate it here.

  38. mars08

    John,

    I agree with the bulk of this article. Things are far more complex than the politician and media are telling us. The public is, yet again, being fed a fraction of the story.

    But… you lost me with this:

    How many jets does Saudi Arabia have? How many does Egypt have? What about Iran, Jordan, Turkey? What are they doing to intervene in this conflict? This is their turf; their area of responsibility. Would any of those countries send their jets to Fiji or Samoa or Nauru if there was an outbreak of unspeakable violence there?

    It’s their turf???? Oh really??? Seems to me that many of those folks would question that view.

    Why no mention of Sykes-Picot? Why no mention of PNAC? Why no mention of the brutal UN (??) sanctions which devastated Iraqi society? Why no mention of the decades of meddling by the west in that region? Why no mention of the west backing militant Islamic groups in Syria? Why no mention of the US wanting to be the global cop? Why no mention that nations like Iran and Turkey have on-going internal conflicts? Why no mention of the US backed corruption of democracy in Egypt?

    Certainly it’s a problem that’s best sorted our by the parties directly involved, but to make it out to be an entirely “Arab” problem is stretching things.

    Sorry John… we can’t just walk away and say it’s THEIR problem. We can’t deny responsibility.

  39. Kaye Lee

    As of 2012, the U.S. Air Force operates more than 5,638 aircraft, 450 ICBMs and 63 satellites. It has a $140 billion budget with 332,854 active personnel, 185,522 civilian personnel, 71,400 reserve personnel, and 106,700 air guard personnel

    The Royal Saudi Air Force has developed from a largely defensive military force into one with an advanced offensive capability. The RSAF maintains the third largest fleet of F-15s after the USAF and the JASDF (Japan). They have between 1000 and 1500 planes/helicopters.

    The United Arab Emirates Air Force has around 4,000 personnel and operates approximately 368 fixed and rotary wing aircraft.

    Israel has over 400 fighter jets alone.

    As of 2013 the Turkish Air Force ranks third in NATO in terms of fleet size behind the United States Air Force and the Royal Air Force. According to the Flight International (Flightglobal.com) and the International Institute for Strategic Studies, the Turkish Air Force has an active strength of 60,000 military personnel and operates approximately 643 manned aircraft.[

    I understand we are sending them up to eight more planes with two support craft. One wonders why.

  40. jimhaz

    My guess is that most Arab countries wont fight in strength to protect Shites.

    “Sunni and Shia Islam are the two major denominations of Islam. The demographic breakdown between the two denominations is difficult to assess and varies by source, but a good approximation is that 87–89% of the world’s Muslims are Sunni[1] and 11–12% are Shia

    Sunnis are a majority in most Muslim communities: in Southeast Asia, China, South Asia, Africa, and most of the Arab world. Shia make up the majority of the citizen population in Iran, Iraq, and Bahrain, as well as being a politically significant minority in Lebanon”

  41. Möbius Ecko

    Kaye Lee if the report I heard this morning is accurate none of those non-Western countries you quote are participating outside of providing bases and air space. Up until Obama and Kerry stepped in many were gearing up to fight and some had started to be active against ISIL, but then on the formation of the COWW (Western Willing) those ME countries stepped back. Why fight and risk personnel, assets and Arab ire when you can let the West do it all for you and wear it all.

    The troops on the ground will be Iraqis and moderate Syrians, which I thought was bullshit until I found out they are genuine moderates. Though armed and trained by the West that’s about the extent of front line fighting any of the ME nations will engage in.

  42. mars08

    No need to wonder why, Kaye Lee. It’s a token amount so that Major-General Mayhem can CLAIM he us saving the world and get some nice photo opportunities with the troops. Should work wonders for his manhood! !!

  43. Terry2

    On Friday the Director General of ASIO placed us on a High level alert for likely homeland terrorism attacks : then he went into retirement.

    Today our Prime Minister authorised the deployment of 600 defence personnel to the Middle East together with eight F18 Super Hornet fighters and then he went to stay on a remote Aboriginal community for a week.

    Last month, to everyone’s amazement we had a jobs surge of 120,000 new jobs, the biggest one month surge on record and nobody can account for it or point to where the jobs are.

    In the weekend press we were told that the Chinese government is reducing steel production in Hebei Province – 148 steel mills and one quarter of Chinese steel output – by 15 million tonnes this year and by 60 million tonnes over the next three years and this is being replicated elsewhere in China. This has the potential to cripple our iron ore industry and put further downward pressure on prices : this could also severely damage our coal exports and potentially put our economy into recession.

    There is something very strange going on out there – very much a case it seems of ‘don’t look here,look over there’.

  44. mars08

    jimhaz:

    My guess is that most Arab countries wont fight in strength to protect Shites…

    Sure. If you want to see everything in that region as a purely sectarian thing.

    Or…

    Saudi Arabia and the other gulf states don’t like the growing regional power and influence of Iran. Especially the good relations that have developed between Tehran and Baghdad in the past decades. They would prefer that Iraq stay outside Iran’s sphere of influence… and Sunni control of the north could give them that buffer.

  45. Ricardo29

    Labor took a principled stand against the first Iraq war and the bullshit weapons of mass destruction. I join with all of those who are saddened and angered by Shorten’s me- too attitude. Hate it that we are lickspittles of the US. Disappointed in Obama. Depressed about the Murdochracy’s support for this pathetic attempt by Abbott to divert attention away from his domestic problems. The only thing I will say in defence of Labor is that Abbott and the scumbags have attacked our lifestyle on so many fronts it must be hard to know how and where best to tackle them, not aided by an unsympathetic media. Any anti-war rallies planned?

  46. Kaye Lee

    I have an uneasy feeling we may have just been played. I have been trying to work out why on earth ISIL would release those beheading videos….unless they wanted to sucker in the west because the other fundamentalist Muslim groups who currently condemn ISIL’s barbarism, if pressed to make a choice, would probably line up with anyone against America. Will our involvement just anger more people? Will it make a lone wolf attack here more likely? NATO have a large presence in the area and just met in Ireland…I notice Julie Bishop horned in on the official table. Considering the resources in the area, our sending a couple of planes is just silly. It is a token force and I would imagine that the more disparate groups there are, the harder it is to co-ordinate them. Rushing into this is very ill-advised as we cannot offer any significant military assistance and it could get very ugly in Syria who have said they will engage any jets that fly over their air space. I hate the idea of being involved in a civil war about Assad. It isn’t our place to do so but choosing groups to arm there inevitably means choosing sides. If one of our planes gets shot down we immediately lose 12.5% of our capability. Are we going to send more people then to kick butt? Whose butt do we kick? What will Russia do? Who is arming ISIL? No wonder the rest of the world is hesitant to commit – everyone except Uncle Sam and the boy wonder.

  47. givingittoustraighter

    Hey Kath! I respect ur thoughts. I really do. But very very narrow minded. Do u think we should just stand back? Do u think if we don’t help it will make us less of a target for a ‘lone wolf’. However ur comment on cutting the dole and the $7 dollar fee for a doctors visit (as we all know low income earners and pensioners will be exempt if it is to ever pass through both houses) really doesn’t deserve a reply! Wow we have it really tough here don’t we! Hahahaha. I gotta say a little bit of life experience will change ur thinking. Grow up soon!

  48. Annie Byam

    John …. as always, a very well written article – covering most all points …. and I sadly agree with you.

    ========

    Florence nee Fedup ……… 10.48 am comment.

    If indeed Shorten was ‘briefed by Abbott’ …. then I don’t think Shorten was naive at all. He apparently let it be known that Abbott was the one who informed him – which is exactly what he should have done ….. quietly dobbing the idiot in. And thereby raising concerns ( as you have said – you are concerned … and so am I, many of us ).

    Maybe that’s why I heard Abbott last night mutter very quickly at the end of his speech something like ” of course this has to be passed by Cabinet”. I only just caught it, so it is not verbatim, and I cannot find any reference to it.

    ========

    My browser has been ‘changed’ for some reason, which I am about to report to Google ( I use Chrome ) …. I did not request or ok that change. But it goes now to the MSN Bing search … something rather strange is happening !! ,,,, It is nowhere near as precise and helpful as Google is. Microsoft can ‘bib in’ to the way people’s computers operate at any time they wish. Hope you all know that.

    And who knows who’s side THEY might be on – in the U.S. and everywhere else there is an M/S product ?

  49. Sir ScotchMistery

    Let’s suppose that a bunch of MSM “journo’s” head off to cover the war that isn’t.

    Let’s suppose one of them becomes “another western ‘journalist'” captured by ISIL.

    What will the results of that little exercise in “oil democracy” be worth to RAbbott when it becomes front page around the world.

    Selfservatives are not in the business of education and learning, let’s be honest.

  50. corvus boreus

    givingittoustraighter,
    Quit with the ‘u’ and ‘ur’, these indicate guttural and confused grunts.
    End your questions with a question mark(?).
    Talk grown up(u gotta catch ’em all).

  51. Kayla Flamenco Malaysia

    Kaye Lee ……. still hitting nails on heads! Some of the most well equipped and wealthy nations in the world are right there and they are also largely responsible for the creation of, financial support of, training of, supplying of and encouragemet of the complete chaos that is the Middle East.

  52. Sir ScotchMistery

    @ givingittoustraighter I have to agree with Corvus B. When you go off on those little diatribes, your 15 year old spelling is a distraction.

    In fact from my perspective, the more we here in IndiMedia whinge about ALP/LNP sameness, the less things change. In terms of “whose fight is it?”, it’s a fight that essentially has to be fought and won by those who practice Islam at a non-radicalised level. We see plenty of folks in Australia who understand that it’s all different styles of trickery and mythology, but no one seems to be prepared to stand up and say “you stop your people doing this shit”, then we’ll do whatever we can to make your life easier.

    It is errant nonsense to describe the history of wars in the Mesopotamian theatre as “civil wars”. They aren’t now and never have been, for the simple reason that most of the combatants don’t see themselves as part of the “country”. Their minds appear to work at a village/family level and don’t see the killing of their “members of parliament” or WTF they call it as an attack on their country. They are just these microscopic little bedsores on the arse of the nation whose borders they stay within, and attacks on folk outside the village aren’t their problem, either directly or indirectly. They simply don’t care.

    Much more positive in my view, would be to stop supporting those Saudis who feel it’s incredibly important to demonstrate penis size with sports cars, half brained jet pilots related to the “house of saud”, who spend their days rushing about the desert spending the oil millions they get from the US and others, and head chopping. These are the same people who are being thought of as cool to send against ISIL, in the gifted US jets.

    Wonder why USA has never given Australia 400 jets? Let’s face it they spend more time up to their nuts in the guts of our pollies, than anyone elses. Seems they/we should have earned a few gifts from the “great war-monger”.

    At the end of the day, I am still gob-smacked that the USA doesn’t call the saudis out for funding ISIL and allowing Al Quaeda to be funded as well. The addition of thousands of choppings of heads doesn’t rate a mention. Why should that, I guess?

    And for the record, I don’t ever capitalise anything to do with the saudis..

  53. donwreford

    What to me is disturbing about Abbott, he always seems to follow a system that is militant and repressive, I have understood a leader who makes decisions to go to war, is often popular, I talked to a friend about this curious idea, they said it makes people feel safe if they have a enemy, satisfying this feeling of insecurity, surely this cannot be right, I have many insecurities as a result of the many idiots that are in power, or have power, the idea of going to war is not something that placates me, on the contrary makes me feel that I am right, we have in power those who are a blend of stupidity and who are out of touch, are on a path to a reckless outcome.

  54. lefturnahead

    We all know Abbott is doing this to improve his ” Poll” position,but what will he do if after all this his poll numbers keep going South? Now that will be a scary situation.”

  55. margaret millar

    I was shocked and appalled as soon as I heard that straight away -with great haste -as if he could hardly wait to get us into a war again- Our Prime Minister –without any consultation with Parliament –announced he was sending troops to Syria to involve us in a war that has nothing to do with us ! Again!–Like the debacle of Iraq- that has left that country full of turmoil l ever since.!!

  56. Möbius Ecko

    Worse and far more scary lefturnahead is if his polls improve like Howard’s did. Abbott will take it as a licence to become a complete neo-fascist and warmonger, invoking the most draconian security policies, completely closing down government to scrutiny and looking for every conflict he can.

  57. mars08

    Sir ScotchMistery:

    At the end of the day, I am still gob-smacked that the USA doesn’t call the saudis out for funding ISIL…

    I suppose that would rely on the US really believing it was a problem.

    But then… who-on-earth could have seen this coming, eh? It’s not like there were warning signs or previous examples of such stupidity…!

    Rebel Arms Flow Is Said to Benefit Jihadists in Syria
    October 14, 2012

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/15/world/middleeast/jihadists-receiving-most-arms-sent-to-syrian-rebels.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&

    Who finances ISIS?
    19 June, 2014

    http://www.dw.de/who-finances-isis/a-17720149

    Our terrorists
    2 October, 2009

    http://newint.org/features/2009/10/01/blowback-extended-version/

    Extremist element among Syrian rebels a growing worry
    10 September, 2013

    http://www.nbcnews.com/news/other/extremist-element-among-syrian-rebels-growing-worry-f8C11115141

    The terrorists fighting us now? We just finished training them.
    August 18, 2014

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/08/18/the-terrorists-fighting-us-now-we-just-finished-training-them/

    Report: Syrian rebel forces trained by West are moving towards Damascus
    23 August, 2013

    http://www.jpost.com/Middle-East/Report-Syrian-rebel-forces-trained-by-West-are-moving-towards-Damascus-324033

  58. Kaye Lee

    Isn’t is interesting that we have to slash billions from foreign aid but then spend billions on military toys and have an open-ended budget to support going and using the toys just so we can wreck more of the country and make more asylum seekers who we then spend billions keeping from our shores.

    How about increasing foreign aid, decreasing inequality, eliminating poverty, providing food, clean water, shelter, health and education to the billions of people who do not have these necessities.

    The richest 85 people on the globe between them control as much wealth as the poorest half of the global population put together (3.5 billion people). 16% of the world’s population use 80% of the world’s resources.

    One of the reasons we don’t have suicide bombers in Australia is because life is good. Though if we don’t learn to share, and continue to naively interfere in other countries at the behest of the US, we may well piss someone off enough to want to teach us a lesson.

    My mother taught me early on, you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar. She also taught me that aggression breeds aggression.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mn91L9goKfQ

  59. mars08

    Kaye Lee:

    …spend billions on military toys and have an open-ended budget to support going and using the toys just so we can wreck more of the country…

    Given the difficulty in assessing who’s who on the ground and sorting the “goodies” from the “baddies”… how long before one of our jets kills a bunch of innocent civilians? Then, no doubt, we’ll see the old, reliable “human shield” story rolled out as an excuse.

  60. atkenos

    Menzies lied when he said that the Vietnamese President asked for Aussie troops. Howard lied when he said that Sadam had WMDs. Abbott lies about everything and thinks we are fools. Actually, many are and will blindly support him. But I fear that as a result of what is happening a bigger war is coming closer, and ABbott et al will act as home based generals while sending the poorer classes, as always, to die

  61. Sir ScotchMistery

    @atkenos .. and yet we still elect proven liars, from both sides of the house, to high office.

    We are a nation of halfwits and with apologies to those who disagree, we have exactly the government we deserve, because we don’t hold them or the MSM to account.

    Definition of an idiot I believe is someone who does the same thing over and over, and expects a different result.

  62. Terry2

    The coalition of the reluctant has now been extended to 30 nations including ten Arab nations which is a credit to John Kerry and his negotiating skills.

    Our role should now be de-escalated and we should restrict ourselves to humanitarian aid – airdrops of blankets, water, medical supplies and food, not guns : keep the FA18 Hornets in their hangars.

    Let’s not forget that the face of ISIL is ‘Jihad John’ a thug from South London who is nothing more than a pathological killer.

  63. Kaye Lee

    Terry2,

    I just made the same comment on Michael’s article

  64. Kath Malcom

    Hey Giveitabreak,
    I don’t giveafark what you think, go take a long walk off a short plank,
    You have no idea, You need to take your dummy out of your gob before you speak again
    Because it dosnt make sense it’s just babble, you seem brainwashed by Phony Tony
    Good luck with that…..
    I have a feeling you are about to hit rock bottom, and your neighbours can’t stand you either
    They apparently say you are the fattest, laziest big mouth bogan that needs to mow your lawn and tidy up, your joint is devaluing the rest of the street, not very liked hey? Lol
    How do I know this, you guess lol

  65. All's Not Lost

    Kath,

    I don’t know if you noticed but 3 innocent westerners just got their heads lopped off by these barbarians, one of whom was kidnapped from Turkey. What is it you think we should do in response to that? Nothing?

  66. Kaye Lee

    All’s Not Lost,

    Are you suggesting we go to war wherever there are beheadings…or only if they behead westerners?

    “A Sinai-based militant group said on Thursday it had beheaded four Egyptians, accusing them of providing Israel with intelligence for an airstrike that killed three of its fighters.

    Four headless corpses were found in the Sinai Peninsula earlier this month, security sources said.

    The Sinai militants are not believed to be officially linked to Islamic State insurgents. However, Egyptian intelligence officials say the group has influenced Egyptian militants who are based just over the border with Libya.

    The officials say the Libya-based fighters have also established contacts with Ansar Bayt al-Maqdis.”

    Do we also bomb Egypt and Libya with our eight planes?

  67. Kath Malcom

    They chose to go into these countries these journos and aid workers, they know the risks very well, how many innocent people will be the collateral damage of this “war” on terrorists, it will be more than 3 it will be thousands history tells us that, you can’t trust the yanks, take a look at the foreign news not the murdoch shit here, and you will get a more balanced informed view on this, um Syria thousands upon thousands of people killed there, gassed you name it a for a.few years now, 10s of thousands of tent cities in Jordan, Turkey etc full of Syrians,
    where have the good ole US of A been ? geee no where to be seen, has just left that one alone, didn’t want to get involved, they are cherry picking as usual and Phony Tony is jumping on bandwagon cos he thinks it will increase his popularity,
    sooooo yea too bad for them few foreign people who chose to be in the middle of a war in Middle East countries, but many many many more innocent people will die who are not journos or aid workers, it will be women and children, there are no winners in war, only losers casualties and innocent victims in that country, like the last couple American invasions into other countries, America pfffttt pfffttt and pffft, war mongers that’s all…

  68. All's Not Lost

    Kaye Lee,

    We should not allow anyone to be killed by these fanatics, but yes, westerners in particular. If a family member of yours was travelling in Turkey and got kidnapped and publicly beheaded I’m sure it would be more upsetting to you than if it were some random Iraqi. It’s just human nature. But the deaths of any innocents should not be ignored if it’s possible to do something.

    Are you saying we should do nothing to stop these lunatics? I saw a previous post of yours where you suggested practical, humanitarian aid. That’s a nice sentiment and I agree with it, but how do we keep them safe? One of those beheaded was an aid worker.

  69. Kath Malcom

    How many be headings a year in Saudi Arabia, geeee lots and lots, don’t see the Yanks jump to their defence, cos America pump a lot of money into Saudi Arabia, geee cherry picking again is America..

  70. All's Not Lost

    Kath,

    A humanitarian aid worker gets his head cut off and it’s “too bad”? Hokay.

  71. Kath Malcom

    Yep it is too bad, he was a grown man and made a choice, unlike the innocent victims who will have no choice when America and other western countries start bombing civilians to root out the terrorists, it’s a joke Joyce, yes a joke, but not a very funny one, and it will end badly for Obama and Tony, not even the UK have rushed in like our Tones, what a fool of a man 🙂

  72. All's Not Lost

    Remind me never to risk my well being coming to your aid because you obviously wouldn’t give a shit if I were to be harmed. And btw, innocent victims are already being slaughtered in Iraq. I get that you don’t believe anything should be done about that but others will take a different moral view of that.

  73. Kaye Lee

    All’s Not Lost,

    Well yes I would feel more if it was a family member but I would not feel more for a westerner that I don’t know than I do for “some random Iraqi” who also happens to have a family.

    Aggression breeds aggression. We need to look at why this is happening rather than adding salt to the wound. I know it is a very complex problem but the West have dirty hands in adding to that problem. To ride in like saviours makes people remember what the US has done in the past.

  74. Kath Malcom

    Noooo don’t bother risking your “well being”
    I wouldn’t come to your aid anyways, more important things on my to do list 🙂
    And it’s not arguing with brainwashed lettuce leaves, have a great day hey 🙂

  75. All's Not Lost

    Kaye Lee,

    I agree the West have dirty hands. We effectively unleashed this crop of fanatics when we shat all over Iraq previously. It’s ironic that we are currently doing what Saddam Hussein was himself doing – violently suppressing Islamic nutjobs. Makes our deposing of him look kind of stupid. I also agree that aggression breeds aggression, but the trouble is these are people who cannot be reasoned with. If they are willing to cut off the heads of humanitarian aid workers I’m not sure there’s any chance of anything other than aggression being effective. And we must stop them. The world cannot afford to have this sort of religious fanaticism get stronger and spread its influence. We’re already seeing it happen in Turkey. Few years from now it’ll be as big a shithole as Iraq and Syria.

    If there was a meaningful option to aggression I’d be all for it, but I’m not really seeing one.

  76. Kaye Lee

    I agree ISIL must be stopped. I disagree with us being part of a combat force. In my view, the ADF should be a defence rather than an attack force which concentrates any military action to defence of us and our allies. Our international role should be what we are good at – disaster relief, search and rescue, humanitarian aid, medical assistance, engineering, evacuation etc. We can make a far greater contribution in these areas. We cannot ever be a significant player in military action but we can be a crucial player in those areas.

    We should leave the military action to Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Iraq, the Kurds…Israel even – the people whose daily lives it affects. If they choose to ask for American assistance then ok…that is the yanks forte, not ours. I am not questioning the bravery of our forces or the contribution they have made in past wars, just being practical. Our support should be constructive, not destructive.

  77. mars08

    Some confusion here. Can someone please help me out…?

    We can all agree that ISIS are nasty.

    We’re being told that we should do something to stop these lunatics. We were also told that Bashar al-Assad was a creep who (allegedly) used chemical weapons against his own people… and that something should be done about it.

    Now… ISIS fighters have been successful in “liberating” parts of Syria from the al-Assad government.

    Okay, so are we going to crush ISIS (and their allies) and let al-Assad’s forces take the territory back? Or are we going to bomb ISIS and al-Assad’s forces and hope some nice, acceptable group steps into the vacuum? Or are we just going to blow some shit up, declare victory… and forget about it… just like the last time?

  78. DanDark

    Yep Mars 08 “we just going to blow some shit up, declare a false victory and forget about it …just like last time”
    sooo much for that victory,, its not looking to victorious for them yanks and allies now, because wars are futile and we learn nothing, only how to make more weapons of mass destruction, Americas got to keep that war machine going at all costs, so does Tones and co,, how much for a few Japanese subs, big big bucks in war machines….

  79. mars08

    DanDark:

    Yep Mars 08 “we just going to blow some shit up, declare a false victory and forget about it…

    Cool… no need to switch from the proven formula then!! Just hope the mainstream media are “on-board” with that.

    Now… if only there was some way to get those fancy, new subs deployed into northern Iraq….!

  80. DanDark

    yes mmmmm now those babies just keep going up in price day by day now, so who knows if we can afford them now, as we have that big bad deficit and debt hanging around our necks as the Coal ition kept reminding us, but plenty of money for big boy toys, that go bang bang you are dead…

  81. mars08

    Why so cynical, DanDark. Australia needs them because ….ISIS!!! China!!!! etc etc…

  82. DanDark

    Mars
    Cynical is my second name now, I watched a video sometime ago sent by an astute friend, and well it was everyday yanks off the street being asked who they should invade next, and We were on the hit list, so was Korea, so was a lot of countries, these were ordinary Yanks off the street, now that was scary, when they answered, “yes we will invade Australia next” I was gob smacked at this arrogance of everyday yanks, and they think it is their right to just go invade other countries on their moral compass, Guatamo Bay ring a bell moral compass pfftt, watching and listening to that was frightening, they are our allies? NOT according to a lot of ordinary Yanks,,just their national anthem gives their arrogance away, and it talks a lot about foes and wars and wins, and being Brave?
    and “In God is our trust”, sounds like our Tones, always rattling on about his God 🙂

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmwv1N6aTJI

  83. mars08

    Yeah… “land of the free… home of the brave” isn’t the best description….

  84. All's Not Lost

    Kaye Lee,

    Israel? Really? I think we know what would happen if Israel were to get involved militarily. Kaboomy! Up goes the middle east.

    As for Iraq, they asked for help so it’s obvious they can’t handle things. It would be great if certain Muslim nations like Saudi Arabia took a stand and helped out but that’s not going to happen. Plus I don’t think we could trust a slimeball nation like Saudi Arabia to remotely care about limiting civilian causalities or any other humanitarian concept.

    I’m speaking more about IS in Iraq. Syria is such a gigantic mess I don’t how anyone can tell what to do or who to help there. Things are rather more clear cut in Iraq.

    It would be great if America has kept it’s grubby paws off the rest of the world over the last few decades, but they didn’t and we now have the dreadful but real consequences to deal with.

  85. Kaye Lee

    I know…Israel was going too far. As far as the others go….

    From yesterday’s UK press….note how we don’t rate a mention. That must really grate for Tony.

    “Today John Kerry is attending a summit in Paris with some of the 20+ countries who are thought to be in the group of states who have pledged their support in the fight against the Islamic State. Those attending, according to the French government are: Bahrain, Belgium, Canada, China, the Czech Republic, Denmark, Egypt, France, Germany, Iraq, Italy, Japan, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, the Netherlands, Norway, Oman, Qatar, Russia, Saudi Arabia, Spain, Turkey, United Arab Emirates, United Kingdom.”

    http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/who-is-in-the-coalition-of-the-willing-and-what-is-the-coalition-of-the-unwilling–lJwQmUBqEe

  86. Kath Malcom

    Well this is not a surprise Abbott has to break another election promise to stay the week up north, action man can’t rough it for a week in a tent, or has realised he is not our first people besty friend, he has no friends, Nigel no friends again 🙂
    Wars in other countries are more important now, and Commander Cockhead needs a bricks and mortar building to complete his mission it seems…

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/16/tony-abbott-may-cut-short-election-pledge-arnhem-land-visit

  87. All's Not Lost

    Kaye Lee,

    Interesting link. Thanks for that.

  88. nickthiwerspoon

    Bill Shortchanged fails again. Depressing. Voting Green 1 and Labor 2 next election.

  89. All's Not Lost

    Shorten has most assuredly not failed in relation to this issue, despite his overall space wasting. There’s not a thing he can do other than what’s he’s doing. Anyone who thinks otherwise is incapable of sensibly judging politics.

  90. Terry2

    Very strange that the UN in New York is hosting 120 heads of state on Tuesday 23 September to a Climate Change Summit. When asked why he wasn’t attending, Mr Abbott said that we would be better served with him in Parliament in Canberra: sound about right ?
    Well, Mr Abbott will actually be in New York the following day to attend a UN Security Council meeting………….Go Figure !

    Perhaps Mr Shorten could ask a question in parliament.

  91. mars08

    All’s Not Lost:

    Syria is such a gigantic mess I don’t how anyone can tell what to do or who to help there. Things are rather more clear cut in Iraq.

    If that’s what you really think… you haven’t been paying attention!! In recent months Sykes-Picot has been shown to be a fragile, arbitrary decoration on the map. But the people of that region have known that for a long time. As far as ISIS and it’s allied insurgent groups are concerned… there are no borders. The cancer is spreading… you either take the time and effort to cut it all out… or don’t even bother.

  92. Tom in Ngunnawal country

    Do unto others as rednecks and bogans in marginal seats would have you do.

  93. Annie Byam

    I have come on line again, and read, ( as most everyone has who has subscribed ) …. about 60 ++ responses to this article, in my Inbox.

    Sure got one helluva lot of people going, didn’t it ?

    Problem is, many are arguing amongst themselves. Taking cheap shots here and there, and putting forth new ideas, which are then damned and blasted in the next comment or two ??…. Have a sneaking suspicion that true debate, has done a bunk on this one.

    HOWEVER, many have had much to say that has enlightened me, and furthered my own understanding of the situation in the Middle East, and no doubt enlightened many other readers.

    That being said, I would really like to remind us all ( me included ) that terrorism is NOT confined to the Middle East. While it is unconscionable, unbelievable and totally reprehensible, that any group of persons can use beheadings as a source of propaganda and threat …. forms of terrorism has long been among us. Domestically, in neighbourhoods, States and countries ( global ) , and amidst various religious zealous sectors ….. the world over. It is something we have lived with since feudal times.

    The ante has been raised … due largely to ‘instant’ media reporting. Not much can happen in the world today that is not posted on some form of social media – or elsewhere, almost instantly. Which raises our consciousness …. and thus our conscience.

    Where in this particular ‘debate’ is our conscience. Is it with getting rid of the blight that attacks disenfranchised society as we understand it – by destroying the jihadists and ISIS ? ….. is it interfering with an area that will ALWAYS be in conflict – no matter what ( history will attest more than peaceful interludes ) ? …. is it in allowing a powerful Western power to dictate – and have all other ‘allies’ follow ? …. is it in fact NOT interfering and allowing the powers in that region ( who are more than used to this kind of chaos, mayhem and ghastly forms of retribution, threat and terror ) …. or to let the Middle East fight it out amongst themselves ( as they have been doing on and off for centuries ) ???? The United Arab countries have many many times more military infrastructure than we ( Australia ) have …. yet they are sitting back and ……… waiting. That’s the way they operate. Whether we agree with that stance or not, is not relevant – at all.

    =====

    In the face of this upgrading of terror, … yes, we, as a decent, largely peaceful country, should take a stand. Whether it be a large or small contribution does not matter. We need to be seen as going AGAINST the potential of the worst kind of terrorism and horror, to date, and to help stamp it out of existence. Never mind alliance, never mind who is controlling who in the political world …. decent people should rise up and show their utter determination to face and defeat this new form of threat to stability in the world.

    The big question is ….. will that stop it …. any of it. ???????

    That is doubtful – for a while at least. The mould has been set, and the die cast. …. We must deal with it the best way we can, here – and to a degree – over there.

  94. Annie Byam

    @Kaye Lee ( post .3.26 pm ). Yes, that would grate a lot on Abbott. He has plunged in like some lunatic ‘war-lord’ …. for his own political purposes ,,,,,, I don’t doubt that. By the same token though, no matter who was in Government at this time, I believe it ( they ) would have offered some form of assistance to attempt to rid the earth of this scourge that is ISIS / ISIL. I would have to believe that is just human decency.

    And ref. your post 11.24 am. I agree with your comments Kaye.

    “Beheadings” have been a part of the Middle East control and manipulation ( across many tribes and nations ) … for centuries. Nothing much has changed in some sectors. In some it has, thankfully.

    You mentioned ‘militants’. There are indeed militants, and at times I would think, militants amongst militants – or in the old speak, counter-intelligence / espionage. Old terms admittedly, but I doubt we could be persuaded that jihadists, wouldn’t have their own ‘enemies within’. Any country / State / organisation / company – invites the possibility of some form of espionage.

    Your comments, well said … as always Kaye.

  95. Annie Byam

    @ All’s not Lost ….. ref :

    “Shorten has most assuredly not failed in relation to this issue, despite his overall space wasting. There’s not a thing he can do other than what’s he’s doing. Anyone who thinks otherwise is incapable of sensibly judging politics.”

    ****

    I agree wholeheartedly. There is nothing he can say at this time. But I believe he will – when the time is right. If he doesn’t …. and misses out on a continous basis, he will have to be replaced.

    Simple – – – – – it’s politics !!

  96. Annie Byam

    @ DanDark ( September 16, 2014 at 2:41 pm ) …..re the “Star Spangled Banner”.

    Be as cynical as you like Dan ….I join you.

    Just recently, a friend from the U.S. ( who beleagues me with U.S. propaganda, U.S, military might and the grand old flag – constantly ) … sent me an article ( did I ask for it ? …. Noooo) …. about the alleged history of the Grand Old Flag, and why it is incorporated in their anthem. Seems that it had to do with the War of Independence … against the British ….. and while the Brits rained down bombs and blasts on the small area of land that the flag was erected upon, NOTHING ( ???) thwarted it – it remained upright and untouched. hmmmm. !! Thus the legend was born which branched into their anthem ( although there is much debate as to who actually wrote the hymn and the lyrics !!! ).

    Doesn’t surprise me one iota that you have come across Yanks who believe we might be invaded or overthrown in some way, at some time. …. their collective arrogance knows no bounds. I am still friendly with many ordinary Yankee folk, but don’t trust that they won’t throw the ‘ We are the greatest’ pitch at me from time to time …….. which I totally ignore, I might add.

    As for Guantanamo Bay …..don’t let me get too well started. !! While many there were most likely guilty of some terrorist mindset, they were never given proper due process through courts of law …. and I think the torture treatment of any and all is substantiated fact. So much for the ‘land of the free … and the home of the brave ? ‘ ….. Bah bloody humbug.

  97. givingittoyoustraight

    Oh Kath, really shows ur sad little personality when weird comments come from ur mouth before u even think. I guess that’s why u are here…..everyone else would tell you to shut the #?!) up. Hahahah. I feel for u. I really do. My neighbours love me because I have common sense. Infact Mrs Mangle is out mowing my lawn as we speak. Then I will have her prune my bush as not to devalue the street! Hahahaha. I mean where do u even come up with stories like that. Are u a part time drugo? What does that even have to do with our discussion……a little bit of track lady.adamfuary@gmail.com

  98. givingittoyoustraight

    Like I said originally Kath I respect ur original comments but u need to respect others too! And personal digs just makes u look the fool! Have a nice day!

  99. Kath Malcom

    Haha you are a full time idiot Giveitabreak 🙂

  100. giveittoyoustraight

    Ohhhh Kath by the way I live on the 8th floor of an apartment…..no real neighbours & no yard. Hahaha. Agree to disagree?

  101. Kath Malcom

    Oh good the 8 th floor, watch your step it’s along way down pmsl, could seriously get hurt, 8 floors hey lol lol lol lol tooo funny Giveitamoment 🙂

  102. Kath Malcom

    Yea I will disagree with you but hey it’s been a laugh a minute Giveitaminute lol
    But no hard feelings hey, mmmm the 8 th floor, do you have to wash the outside of windows lol
    Just watch your step if you do or it could end in tears lol. 🙂

  103. Möbius Ecko

    Abbott loves guns and war. Here he’s lovingly looking at a machine gun. He broke his promise (twice) to spend a full week in an Aboriginal community for this.

    And do you want to know how much the media are protecting Abbott. A photo of him ignoring an aboriginal boy’s outstretched hand for a handshake whilst patting the boy on the head was cropped to not show the outstretched hand of the boy and altered to make Abbott look better.

  104. Carol Taylor

    Mobius, you know..if I was a suspicious sort of person then I would think that the whole thing was carefully scripted in order to show *our fearless leader* at his *best*…Abbott International Man of Action..not only single-handedly has he managed to take the fight up to ‘the enemy’ but he is – gasp – going to run The War from a tent!!! OMG, what a man!!

    That is, knowing that a ‘crisis’ of international proportions is apparently impending, so important that Abbott intends to send our young men and women to war, why should he choose this particular time to take off to outback Australia to stay in a tent? It’s not as if Aboriginal people aren’t used to being made to wait…..after all he had already made them wait a year…

    Then of course (and what fantastic publicity this was), Abbott was then ‘forced to leave’ the community in order to wave his hankie at Airforce personnel about to leave. All such a ‘fortunate’ series of events, and such wonderful publicity.

  105. Annie Byam

    Nothing surprises me any more. Not Abbott, not Hockey ( on TV this evening, being ‘grilled’ by Leigh Sales ?? with replies that were nebulous at best ) …. not any of them.

    The whole thing gives me the tom-tits.

    Abbott’s statement that we are ‘not committing troops on the ground’ … and in the next breath says “Australian soldiers would “not themselves normally engage in actual combat”, although the troops “will certainly be armed and, if they’re fired upon, they’ll be entitled to respond”.

    Well of course, they will be entitled to bloodywell respond. Who could or would expect anything else ….they WILL defend themselves, and rightly so. Their lives would depend upon it.

    But there it is ….. “no combat troops, but combat troops if they have to be” ……… What the fark does that mean. Just more double speak from our alleged ‘leader’. ??? They are either there, or they are not. They are either engaged, or they are not ( on the ground ).

    And as soon the U.S. crooks it’s little finger, ding-bat Abbott will deploy more troops – on the ground if ‘commanded’ …. and it’ll be on yet again for our soldiers. For what ?

    To try and stop xxxxxxx number of maniacal radicals, calling themselves the ISIS ( or ISIL if you prefer ) …. from killing innocents.?

    That IS ABSOLUTELY DESIRABLE AND RIGHT…… But …….. FROM THE AIR only. No other way. Do not try to tell me that it is impossible to achieve this end, using only air fire power. It is attainable and must be done. However ………

    As soon as a soldier sets foot on the ground as a troop, carrying weapons to engage with the enemy, war is an absolute. It’s on. And Abbott knows it. ( yipeeee – I can hear his war cries from here ).

    This maniacal leader of our country, with the gaping grin and empty eyes, will make the most of it …. waving flags and bunting at the drop of a news photo op.

    It sickens me ….. beyond belief. ,,,,, and yes, you betcha ….. I am good and angry, ropeable in fact.

    How DARE he make these decisions, unilaterally. ….. I ask you. …… And whether Shorten appears to be in concert or not, it would make no difference to this mongrel at the head of Government – he’d go ahead and do it anyway.

    What an effing mess this is.

  106. Möbius Ecko

    Yes Carol, all carefully stage managed in an attempt to turn a sow’s ear into a silk purse. Illustrates how deeply unpopular Abbott is that the full weight of the MSM and government coffers funding a multi-million dollar Abbott spin machine cannot manage to raise his standings.

    On another front of incongruently with this government, Bishop the Younger announced that Australia has no means to evacuate medical teams and aid workers in Africa caught in the Ebola outbreak.

    WTF, really what the hell Bishop. We can spend $500m pa to send fighter jets, 600 military personnel, massive transport aircraft along with dropping tons of weapons and aid to countries next door to Africa but you can’t help Australians in a non war zone there?

  107. Wake Up

    Abbott is a jew? ( This country is screwed, like all the rest ) The Australian people deserve to be abused, used and fooled for the apathy, stupidity, for being asleep for so long. Drink the shit in the water, eat the poison in the food, and it will all be fine. A long line of Primemonsters towing the line for Zionism and big Corporations. ” Its a big club, and we ain`t in it “….George Carlin.

  108. Annie B

    ” WAKE UP ” – Wake Up !!!

    Abbott is not a Jew, and you know it.

    But ya know – he just might be a better man and a more giving, compassionate and understanding leader if he was.

    Zionism – my foot. That was an independent political regime begun the late 19th century to establish a home ( the land of Israel ) for Jews and Jewish culture. It has risen and fallen on a regular basis since after WW II …. and Israel has now been established.

    The late Richard Pratt was Jewish and began from the absolute ground up to become an extremely wealthy man – who gave $14million of his OWN money ( not directly from his companies ) EVERY year to worthy causes, including efforts to better the status of refugees.

    On that score alone, the PM and his vile off-sider Morrison, could learn a thing or three. !!

    —–

    Actually, I found your post distasteful at best.

    You got one thing right – big corporations – and Abbott tows those lines to far more of a degree than any other PM in our history.

  109. Wake Up

    Well, Annie B, Seems you have all the answers here, and if you think my post is distasteful, lets progress to vile.

    If Abbott isn`t a jew, then he is a goyim helper, Helping to bring in the new one world Government, (that people are afraid to mention)
    Given the fact that our media is owned and run like puppets, and told what they can and cannot say. And under new laws by our own Government, they literally can`t say much at all on matters like the G20, except to praise it while polishing their masters backsides for fear of imprisonment should they say the wrong thing.

    I would say our country is well on the way to becoming a fascist police state, and as a matter of fact we are almost there.

    All it will take is a few more pandemic scares and a false flag terror operation, and the sheeple will be lining up for more Government protection at the expense of more rights lost to the state.

    That’s if we still have any rights left.

    As for Israel being born in 1948, I can`t fault you on that. But I can tell you how it was done. I have seen old news papers 18 years before Hitler came to power saying 6000000 jews need help and donations because they are living in poverty and dying in Europe, All BS, by a fellow called Rothschild, Even you should be aware of that name in history. And if not, your a fool.

    I could go much farther into this but I think it would fall on deaf ears.

    By the way, where does fluoride come from? and don`t look under anything with .gov in it,

    and why is it in our water? (and I know it isn`t good for our teeth)

    Why do toothpaste tubes in other countries have a label on the back of them saying ( seek medical attention or call poison information on fluoride if swallowed?) and ours don`t.

    You can vote for the 2 party system, yet over the decades nothing changes. It just continues along an agenda Could it be that someone in the shadows runs everything and politics is a sham, You know what a sham is right?

    Welcome to the NEW WORLD ORDER Annie. I promise you, it will be a nightmare on a biblical proportion.

    And just to kick it off, on the 24 December 2014, the ATT comes into effect. Basically outlawing firearms globally for all civilians on this planet. This is a UN rule of global law. They are your owners now.

    Finding this all a little hard to swallow? it will get worse.

  110. Annie B

    To Wake up ……..

    Might surprise you, but I agree with most of your recent post here. ,,,, And quite happy to progress to ‘vile’.

    There are no deaf ears sitting at this keyboard ……. ( there are times I wish they were !! ) …. And I have studied to a degree the history of the Rothschild family – which is interesting but leaves me somewhat ‘cold’. They are Jewish – – – as was Jesus, btw.

    So I am not ‘a fool’ ( answering your comment ) ….. and yep – I do know what a ‘sham’ is. ….. and there’s a lot of it around !!!!

    …….

    As for the New World Order – I am not one to keep my mouth shut on THAT. It is a world domination group brought about by greed and huge money. There are ” alleged ” Christians, Masons, Jews, and a variety of other religious cults, sects or followings – and a good sprinkling of non-religious as well. It is a terrifying concept – the poorer of peoples will simply vanish – or be used as serfs. Well that’s a part of my take on it anyway. I twice ( i.e. first and last time !! ) brought up the subject in mixed family company. Several I think were on the brink of calling the men in white coats – they openly said I was quite crazy to talk about such a thing. hmmmm. Called me a conspiracist and all. No-one in my family knew of it, and if they did ???

    Presume you have heard of the Bilderberg group ? If not …… here is a link to have a look at this delightful ( NOT) entity. There is an enormous amount available thru Google on this lot. http://www.theinsider.org/news/article.asp?id=0369 …….

    ……….. continued —

  111. Bacchus

    And just to kick it off, on the 24 December 2014, the ATT comes into effect. Basically outlawing firearms globally for all civilians on this planet. This is a UN rule of global law. They are your owners now.

    Credibility shot to pieces!

    https://unoda-web.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/English7.pdf

    In the preamble:

    Recognizing the legitimate political, security, economic and commercial interests of States in the international trade in conventional arms,

    Reaffirming the sovereign right of any State to regulate and control conventional arms exclusively within its territory, pursuant to its own legal or constitutional system,

    Mindful of the legitimate trade and lawful ownership, and use of certain conventional arms for recreational, cultural, historical, and sporting activities, where such trade, ownership and use are permitted or protected by law,

    This treaty is about proper regulation and control of international arms trading, with the main aim being to reduce illicit trade and diversion of weapons to terrorist organisations.

  112. Wake Up

    To Annie B

    You do not varnish your opinions, I will give you that, Not the fool I took you for, and nice to know others are also awake.

  113. Annie B

    Bacchus ………

    Right.

    I still have to wonder which country on this planet might be inclined to ignore the treaty, and go on selling arms and artillery etc. to other countries, for profit – when asked. ……. I have my own opinions on that.

    Pity more gun control couldn’t be put in place ……. but that’s an impossibility.

  114. Wake Up

    To Bacchus,

    This rubbish has nothing to do with the international trade in conventional arms, although they have worded it so.
    In time you will see the real meaning of it, but it will be too late for all to do anything about it.

    And I would wager real paper money (there is no such thing) that the mandatory buy back scheme was mandatory.

    It wasn`t, but everyone was left to think it was. Only one man kept his AR15… This one, like the TPP is nothing more than a spin of lies. All they have to do is make you believe it, so it can get passed, Then it all changes, because the wording is vague.

    And I suppose you think our Federal Reserve is Federal. Its about as Federal as I am.

    Stop defending a system that doesn`t give a crap about you, me , or anyone else, except its own ( sustainability! )

    Currently there are two Governments in this Country. One is the, Commonwealth of Australia, ( the real one ) the other is , The Australian Government, a corporation registered in the U.S.

    One of these things is not like the other, One of these things doesn`t belong… God gave you a brain, use it, and see what is happening all over the world. See the pattern, and you will see the truth.

  115. Bacchus

    Did you read the treaty Annie B? I suggest that might be a good starting point. :roll

  116. Annie B

    @Wake up ……..

    ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,continuing on in reply – – –

    .

    You are right – I do NOT varnish anything – and have been in soooo much trouble because I tend to call spades, shovels – but I can be nice too ……. LOL.

    You mentioned the ATT – that seems to have been covered by Bacchus and my reply. In my former continuation which did not get published ???? …. I did say something similar.

    …..

    There’s the TPP ( Trans Pacific Partnership – agreement ) currently under way. …. It seems to have been much slower coming to fruition than at first thought. ….. THAT spells danger for Australian businesses, and indeed for the Australian Government itself ( such as it is ).

    I stand to be corrected on this – but I think Julia Gillard had a hand in being in agreement to hold these ‘talks’ for a TPP.

    ………..

    You mentioned ” a fascist police state, and as a matter of fact we are almost there. ” …….. I suggest we ARE already there……….. but I don’t think the people of Australia will put up with that crap ….. not even the medium Liberals are happy about anything to do with their fascist little regime in Canberra. And that is exactly how they are behaving – like tyrants, despots – fascists ( all with leering smiles on their faces —– UGH ! ).

    …………

    The new world order ( refuse to use Caps ) ……. ” I promise you, it will be a nightmare on a biblical proportion. ”

    Strange ( or not ) that you should use those words. …….. I have studied religions for 40 years – probably why I am agnostic …. and it is fascinating and bewildering. ……. there is much in the Christian Bible that speaks of ‘ great tribulations’ with the worst possible results. Of course, the cults have jumped aboard all this and are yelling “End Times”……… and are awaiting their deliverance. 7 years is mentioned, but apparently that does not come from the Bible. …. whatever is happening globally now, is not for us to know ……. but change IS occurring, how rapidly is anyone’s guess – and what path it will take – also is an unknown. ….. Guess “Carpe Diem” is good to reflect on at this time.

    …………

    As for fluoride – I don’t know a lot about it – have only read bits and pieces. Dammit – now I have to go search that one out too.

    And finally – re : ” a few more pandemic scares and a false flag terror operation ” …… some will quake in their boots about it, but the majority of Aussies and probably the world population who read, view and listen – are pretty much ‘desensitised’ to these tactics – or at least I certainly hope so. ….. As my husband often says to the TV … ” Oh Gawd – here we go again ” …and I agree … when newscasters spread the word of something else to frighten sh*te out of us ……. which delights them no end. Their old mantra is ” if it bleeds, it leads ” …. and what more delightful a bleed could they have than frightening hell out of the populace – these days almost on a daily basis.

    ……….. ” Be not afraid ” ……….

  117. Bacchus

    Now you have descended completely into the world of “nutjobbery” oh sleepy one. I’m now keeping one eye firmly fixed on you and backing slowly away…

    In Australia, the “federal reserve” is called the Reserve Bank of Australia. It seems you read too many US conspiracy sites while wearing your tinfoil hat!

  118. Wake Up

    http://truth-now.net/ Here is something to munch on while I adjust my hat.

  119. Annie B

    Bacchus ……..

    Re : the ATT.

    There are 12 pages of small print to plough through. I ploughed about half way. …. And no I had not read it before.

    What I did come across which kind of fits in with what “Wakeup” said ( and I didn’t believe it ) is this :

    from https://unoda-web.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/English7.pdf

    This Treaty shall apply to all conventional arms within the following
    categories:

    (a) Battle tanks;
    (b) Armoured combat vehicles;
    (c) Large-calibre artillery systems;
    (d) Combat aircraft;
    (e) Attack helicopters;
    (f) Warships;
    (g) Missiles and missile launchers; and
    (h) Small arms and light weapons.

    What defines ‘small arms and light weapons’. ? e.g. Farmers have to have ( or should have ) what could be called light weapons – single shot small bore rifles, or DB shotguns – to manage their stock ( put them out of misery if sadly needed ) and to rid their pastures of larger vermin etc. …. And what is ‘small arms’ ? …….. to me they are pistols and revolvers.

    I wonder what they mean by that ? …… Police MUST wear their guns … here and elsewhere.

    I will try and get back and read the whole thing through – a big ask I might add 😉 lol.

  120. Bacchus

    Annie B – I think your definition of ‘small arms and light weapons’ is fine. The treaty says nothing about “outlawing firearms globally for all civilians on this planet

    On the contrary, it specifically says, “Recognizing the legitimate political, security, economic and commercial interests of States in the international trade in conventional arms,

    Reaffirming the sovereign right of any State to regulate and control conventional arms exclusively within its territory, pursuant to its own legal or constitutional system,

    Mindful of the legitimate trade and lawful ownership, and use of certain conventional arms for recreational, cultural, historical, and sporting activities, where such trade, ownership and use are permitted or protected by law,

    and

    Object and Purpose
    The object of this Treaty is to:
    – Establish the highest possible common international standards for regulating or improving the regulation of the international trade in conventional arms;
    – Prevent and eradicate the illicit trade in conventional arms and prevent their diversion;
    for the purpose of:
    – Contributing to international and regional peace, security and stability;
    – Reducing human suffering;
    – Promoting cooperation, transparency and responsible action by States Parties in the international trade in conventional arms, thereby building confidence among States Parties.

  121. corvus boreus

    Small arms; firearms capable of being carried and fired by a single person.

  122. Wake Up

    All they need do is make a small amendment to small arms and light weapons, and there gone. We won`t even get to vote on it.
    Like so many other things. (still adjusting my hat)

  123. Bacchus

    Delusional! 🙄

  124. Wake Up

    @ Bacchus

    I will respect, that you don`t believe me, but I do not share your branding of people in such a way as to belittle them.
    I tried, and that’s good enough.

  125. Kaye Lee

    Anyone who suggests that fluoride has not helped in the prevention of tooth decay patently has no regard for facts.

  126. Wake Up

    @ Kale Lee
    Anyone who suggests that fluoride has helped in the prevention of tooth decay, has no regard for the truth.

  127. Bacchus

    It would appear my recommendation to Annie B might well apply to you too – try reading the treaty. Your previous comment shows that you have no understanding of what’s in it at all.
    Article 2
    Scope

    1. This Treaty shall apply to all conventional arms within the following
    categories:
    (a) Battle tanks;
    (b) Armoured combat vehicles;
    (c) Large-calibre artillery systems;
    (d) Combat aircraft;
    (e) Attack helicopters;
    (f) Warships;
    (g) Missiles and missile launchers; and
    (h) Small arms and light weapons.
    2. For the purposes of this Treaty, the activities of the international trade comprise export, import, transit, trans-shipment and brokering, hereafter referred to as “transfer”.
    3. This Treaty shall not apply to the international movement of conventional arms by, or on behalf of, a State Party for its use provided that the conventional arms remain under that State Party’s ownership.

    Any rational person reading this alone can see that it applies to international arms trade. What exactly is “a small amendment to small arms and light weapons” going to do to the treaty – simply allow illicit international trade in these items. Nothing more, nothing less.

    Article 3
    Ammunition/Munitions

    Each State Party shall establish and maintain a national control system to regulate the export of ammunition/munitions fired, launched or delivered by the conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1), and shall apply the provisions of Article 6 and Article 7 prior to authorizing the export of such ammunition/munitions

    Article 6
    Prohibitions

    1. A State Party shall not authorize any transfer of conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1) or of items covered under Article 3 or Article 4, if the transfer 5 would violate its obligations under measures adopted by the United Nations Security Council acting under Chapter VII of the Charter of the United Nations, in particular arms embargoes.
    2. A State Party shall not authorize any transfer of conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1) or of items covered under Article 3 or Article 4, if the transfer would violate its relevant international obligations under international agreements to which it is a Party, in particular those relating to the transfer of, or illicit trafficking in, conventional arms.
    3. A State Party shall not authorize any transfer of conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1) or of items covered under Article 3 or Article 4, if it has knowledge at the time of authorization that the arms or items would be used in the commission of genocide, crimes against humanity, grave breaches of the Geneva Conventions of 1949, attacks directed against civilian objects or civilians protected as such, or other war crimes as defined by international agreements to which it is a Party.

    Article 7
    Export and Export Assessment

    1. If the export is not prohibited under Article 6, each exporting State Party, prior to authorization of the export of conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1) or of items covered under Article 3 or Article 4, under its jurisdiction and pursuant to its national control system, shall, in an objective and non-discriminatory manner, taking into account relevant factors, including information provided by the importing State in accordance with Article 8 (1), assess the potential that the conventional arms or items:
    (a) would contribute to or undermine peace and security;
    (b) could be used to:
    (i) commit or facilitate a serious violation of international humanitarian law;
    (ii) commit or facilitate a serious violation of international human rights law;
    (iii) commit or facilitate an act constituting an offence under international
    conventions or protocols relating to terrorism to which the exporting State is a Party; or
    (iv) commit or facilitate an act constituting an offence under international conventions or protocols relating to transnational organized crime to which the
    exporting State is a Party.
    2. The exporting State Party shall also consider whether there are measures that could be undertaken to mitigate risks identified in (a) or (b) in paragraph 1, such as confidence-building measures or jointly developed and agreed programmes by the exporting and importing States.
    3. If, after conducting this assessment and considering available mitigating measures, the exporting State Party determines that there is an overriding risk of any of the negative consequences in paragraph 1, the exporting State Party shall not authorize the export.6 13-27217
    4. The exporting State Party, in making this assessment, shall take into account the risk of the conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1) or of the items covered under Article 3 or Article 4 being used to commit or facilitate serious acts of genderbased violence or serious acts of violence against women and children.
    5. Each exporting State Party shall take measures to ensure that all authorizations for the export of conventional arms covered under Article 2 (1) or of items covered under Article 3 or Article 4 are detailed and issued prior to the export.
    6. Each exporting State Party shall make available appropriate information about the authorization in question, upon request, to the importing State Party and to the transit or trans-shipment States Parties, subject to its national laws, practices or policies.
    7. If, after an authorization has been granted, an exporting State Party becomes aware of new relevant information, it is encouraged to reassess the authorization after consultations, if appropriate, with the importing State.

    Go and read the whole thing and then get back to me 🙄

  128. Wake Up

    Quoting the document to me means nothing, Seeing through it is what matters. And on that note, I bid you all a good day.

  129. Bacchus

    Perhaps try reading it without your hat on? 😆 😆

  130. Kaye Lee

    I could link you to thousands of studies like this one:

    In its report, Public Health England compared a series of health outcomes between “fluoridated” and “unfluoridated” local authorities.

    The key findings of the report were:

    •there were 15% fewer five-year olds with tooth decay in fluoridated areas than non-fluoridated areas
    •there were 11% fewer 12-year olds with tooth decay
    •there were 45% fewer hospital admissions of children aged one to four for tooth decay (mostly for extraction of decayed teeth under a general anaesthetic) in fluoridated areas than non-fluoridated areas

    One of the most compelling pieces of evidence about the safety of fluoridation comes from the US. Around 200 million people have been exposed to a fluoridated water supply for decades and there have been no credible reports of harm.

    But of course, if YOU think all the medical research is a lie then you must be right.

  131. Wake Up

    Do you have children Kaye Lee ?….. I am the proud father of four, and unlike you, I will not let the shadows behind our so called leaders kill them.

  132. Kaye Lee

    Yes I have children.and I will most definitely listen to doctors and scientists and the mountain of evidence proving the efficacy of fluoride in preventing tooth decay rather than some dude on the internet called Mark. I suppose you are an anti-vaxxer too?

  133. Wake Up

    You are blind, you are a hypocrite, and worst of all, you spew government rhetoric as read from a script.
    Stay asleep and worship the state, I wash my hands of you, shill that you are.

  134. Kaye Lee

    That made me cry John, It is good to be reminded how beautiful and caring the world can be

    And you made me laugh Wake Up I have been called many things but a government shill is a first 🙂

  135. John Fraser

    <

    @Kaye Lee

    Me too ….. and all of the audience.

  136. Annie B

    Am feeling delighted and very pleased, that John has supported Kaye ……..

    after such a revolting and evil swipe at her – about her children.

    I waited – hoping that I wouldn’t have to say what I wanted to ……… and now I won’t…….

    ( It would NOT have been pretty, I can assure you. )

    Wouldn’t give the ‘wake up’ person, the satisfaction.

    ……………

    A beautiful, beautiful link John, thank you – and yes – tears here too.

  137. Florence nee Fedup

    I am 73. I know now we do not see kids mouths full of black teeth we seen during my early years. Worked with kids over the ears. Yes, fluoride did work. If we seen kids come into the office, with rotten teeth, immediately said Queensland. Sadly never wrong. We are a ancient continent where many minerals are bleached out of the soil. All he addition of fluoride has done, is bring the water up to the quality found in the newer continent of Europe. It would be criminal; to remove Fluoride, allowing kids once again to suffer from black rotten teeth.

    You must be very young, not to know, many lost all teeth before they entered their teens.

  138. John Fraser

    <

    @Annie B

    What is this :

    "Am feeling delighted and very pleased, that John has supported Kaye ……..

    after such a revolting and evil swipe at her – about her children."

    ? ? ? ?

  139. Annie B

    To – John Fraser ……..

    so so sorry …… my wording ( I was and still am angry ) was up the well known creek.

    I sincerely hope you have now realised ( despite my weird wording structure ) that I was responding to that ‘wake up’ — um… person … ref. the comment ” after such a revolting and evil swipe at her – about her children. ” ( which wake up made to Kaye – December 2, 2014 at 5:13 pm… it was disgusting )

    We all make mistakes and that was a doozy on my part. I should have referenced the comment with @ Wakeup …… but didn’t ….

    My sincere apologies ……. that was not meant for you AT ALL . ……..

    Good grief – NO.

  140. Annie B

    @ John F ………

    Good.

    ………..

  141. rossleighbrisbane

    “And I would wager real paper money (there is no such thing) that the mandatory buy back scheme was mandatory.”

    I’m still trying to work out Wake-up’s offer to wager real paper money – of which he/she asserts there is no such thing. Well, I’m prepared to wager him Santa Claus against his real paper money.
    Still, I guess my offer Santa Claus suggests that I have no confidence in what I’m wagering. As opposed to his confidence by offering real, fake money?!?
    Right, I’m prepared to wager my fictional thing against your fictional thing…
    Confused, well that’s my point…

  142. Annie B

    @ John Fraser ………..

    The link you provided is so interesting – and hard hitting. Thanks for that. …….

    No matter when it was written or published, it is a bell that has been rung, and cannot be unrung.

    It is also a somewhat frightening article, especially for our current new generation of hopeful Uni students, who simply want to get ahead and use their good studies and work, to their ultimate advantage. …… I have two grandchildren in that age group – and it terrifies me that this incredibly mean approach has even been thought of – let alone tried to be acted upon, by Abbott, Pyne et al. .

    ……….

    The Senate has done the right thing – and I hope they keep dishing the ‘right thing’ up in front end loaders full – to this unspeakably destructive and evil Government.

    Abbott …. I hope ….. is done for.

  143. stephentardrew

    John:

    That was bloody awesome. Thank you.

  144. John Fraser

    <

    @StephenTardrew

    Amongst all the Abbott bullshit and lies one sometimes forgets the beauty in this world.

    The tissues were being handed out in the audience too.

    My wife, while searching for the words to "the Lion sleeps tonight" for the granddaughter came across this one

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V716rhitp1g

    and that angelic voice in the choir (blink and you miss it) led to this :

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V716rhitp1g

    That I came in on the end of dipshit "Wake Up" and his (?) crap was just fortuitous.

    But to be completely honest I had in the back of my mind …. if you remember yesterday Kaye Lee was getting quite a lot of kudo's, and a couple of very flattering proposals ………. something to say/show my gratitude to Kaye Lee.

    Worked too.

  145. Kaye Lee

    Let’s not forget the gun at the head of the universities…

    “The federal government will examine slashing billions of dollars worth of research funding from universities if Parliament blocks its sweeping higher education changes.”

    How bloody minded and short sighted can you get?

    PS thanks for the kind words though they make me feel a tad awkward. I learn as much from you guys as you learn from me. That’s what it is all about – sharing knowledge and truth in what sometimes feels like a world full of liars.

  146. stephentardrew

    John:

    Have a background in Dance and classical and avant guard music.

    Jesse Norman singing Richard Strauss

    Vier letzte Lieder: Four Last Songs 1983

    411 052-2

    Philips Digital Classic

    If you can find it these are some of the most awesome songs and orchestrations I have ever heard.

    If I want a heart felt tear jerk this is where I go. 18 Years later and it still turns me to mush.

  147. Annie B

    John Fraser ……..

    The link : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V716rhitp1g – “The Lion Sleeps Tonight ” ( really beautiful btw ) …….. had in the background support group, as a soprano voice, the little girl who sang ” O MIO BAMBINO CARO ” in another post you put up here.previously …. the one that had some of us in tears, when she was joined by an adult soprano to help her – and comfort her during her act. .

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FimxHxWi8t4

    ………..

    It is the same little girl –

    Is that what you meant by ” and that angelic voice in the choir (blink and you miss it) led to this ” ????

  148. Kaye Lee

    I was on the management committee for a youth refuge where Karise Eden (previous winner of the Voice) lived. I know the struggle that she has endured all her life (living in refuges from the age of 12) and the courage she showed in even auditioning was astonishing.

    Before she went on the show, one day at the refuge, she gave me a CD she had put together when she was 16. I insisted on giving her $20 for it which she tried to refuse. I came home and listened to it thinking I would be encouraging like when my children sing to me – within 30 seconds I was crying. This beautiful girl who life had treated so harshly was able to pour out her heart through her music and her amazing voice.

    Not long after she won the show, she turned up unexpectedly at the local PCYC, where she had received great encouragement, for a “battle of the bands” of local kids. Not only did she do a guest performance for the kids, she donated $10,000 for the kids to make a cd in a recording studio.

    Karise was harassed on social media after winning the show and she basically ran away to Queensland. She is about to become a mother and my heart is so full for her. I am so proud of her courage and I send her my love and best wishes.

    Don’t listen to the selfish haters. Remember to care for each other. As my husband said to me one day when I was having a hissy fit, Hey honey, we are on the same team here. I vote for humanity above greed.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzwlotQVj5g

  149. stephentardrew

    Kaye:

    Was a youth worker years ago and know how it feels. So much pain and tragedy.

    Remember this young woman and was incredibly impressed.

    Real depth and maturity to the voice and superb subtlety of tone and wonderful breath control.

    Just awesome.

    Thanks again.

  150. DanDark

    I voted for Karrise when she was on the voice it’s not something I do on a regular basis, but what a woman and what a voice and she deserved to win, she was on the abc the other week, she looks great and good luck to her in her future role as a mother which she is looking forward too, after the show finished I paid the 20 bucks for her CD it lives in my car, it’s great driving music and it’s a shame it went sour for her after the show……

  151. Kaye Lee

    Sorry to take so much space but her audition is truly amazing. My husband and I were BOTH crying.

    http://vimeo.com/40525332

  152. stephentardrew

    Reminds me of Janice Joplin.

    Good lord she is bloody terrific.

  153. Annie B

    Karise Eden ….. is phenomenal. Thanks for both of them, Kaye. Made my night.

  154. Kaye Lee

    Her CD is fantastic, as DanDark said. No dud songs. Every one more amazing than the last. She said in the show Dan referred to that she is working on a new CD of original songs. I will certainly be buying it.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pfiZA0UCkw

  155. stephentardrew

    Thanks Kaye and John made my night. Just gunna listen to some more.

Leave a Reply

Return to home page
Scroll Up
%d bloggers like this: